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Cranberry

To smack or not to smack?

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I'm not sure French kids are all that good. Certainly, older ones on school trips are quite adept at getting thrown out of places because of disrespectful behaviour.

 

Ah but thats teenagers.

Different rules apply :wink::lol:

It doesn't matter how well brought up the child,get them to that age,bung them in a group & they will behave badly.

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French kids sorry they are no better behaved than any other kids - there are good and bad kids in all nationalities and I should know I work in a multicultural NHS. Its the parents who are to blame (and i admit I am no saint). I would be mortiifed if either of mine had kicked or bitten a nurse or dr when I had taken them for their jabs but its happened to me. And the number running amok in the surgery when at deaths door seeks to amaze me.

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the naughty stair worked well for us, and when resurrected a few months back DS now 15 was horrified "I'm not a baby!"....well stop acting like it then........

 

I wonder if that would work for OH? :think:

 

I did smack my two older children, not often and only when i felt totally necessary, but my youngest, has never been smacked! I think maybe, the older the mum, the more patience and experience she has and maybe better ways of dealing with things. Maybe?

There is however, a whole world of difference between a 'smack' and 'abuse'!

 

More or less the same thing happened in my house. I seem to remember the older 2 having a couple of smacks but I really can't remember the youngest being smacked. My mum and I were discussing this earlier, as it was being discussed on Loose Women. I said to her that I think I've become more patient as I got older and used other ways. I'm not saying its wrong to smack just that I didn't feel I needed to by then.

 

I don't often shout, I had to the other week as youngest was driving me mad and being very sulky (14 years old and hormonal I'm guessing) :roll:

 

I have seen some parents really laying into children though and I find that really scary.

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There's a big furore building over a Coronation Street scene where the middleaged boyfriend of a woman smacked her adopted 10 year old daughter on the legs when he discovered she'd been responsible for killing all the fish in his fishpond with creosote.

 

Everyone seems to be up in arms that they showed this scene and thereby "condoned" smacking but the next episode where the consequences of his actions become clear hasn't even been aired yet :roll: .

 

I seem to remember smacking ES once or twice when he was being absolutely vile to YS and I just saw red.

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I have only smacked my son a couple of times. This is not because he was an angel but because like others have said, different things worked and I never really felt that it was a necessary or appropriate way of teaching him certain behaviour was not on. When he was young, he would have to sit on his bed for 5 minutes - an eternity for such a fidget pants! As he got older, the threat of being horribly embarrassed by me was more successful! Now he is 16, this works even better. The threat of a moistened hanky being applied to his cheek in front of his mates or of me trying to pull up his jeans in public never fails :lol:

There is however, a whole world of difference between a smack and abuse.

I agree. I also hate seeing adults screaming at kids and swearing.
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What an interesting thread and not at all what I had thought it would be - I imagined the vast majority would be absolutley against any physical discipline but there are clearly many considered and balanced comments. Its a very emotive subject but I think that theres lots of commonsense here! :)

 

I, too, have smacked when I felt that there was simply no other way of dealing with the situation or that action had to be taken immediatley. As a 'knee-jerk' lightening reaction in an emergency and employed very, very occasionally I have no problem with the odd smack. However, where the 'smacker' has time to find and use a belt, wooden spoon etc on the 'smackee' that is clearly premeditated and comes under the category of abuse/assult IMHO. :twisted:

 

According to my Mum, I had the odd smack too tho I don't remember it. As far as I am concerned, a parent's responsibility is to raise happy, healthy, considerate, polite and useful members of society and that does entail a fairly strict framework/boundaries.

 

As a footnote, there are several mentions of bad behaviour in the supermarket (both parents and children!) I generally shop on a Friday morning but occasionally have meetings at school on Fridays and so do the supermarket run on a Thursday evening once OH is home. I am usually there about 7.30pm to 8.30pm and am horrified at how many small children (6 and under) are being dragged round....is it any wonder that behaviour is bad under those circumstances with both parents and children clearly shattered!!!!! :shameonu:

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I smacked my children on the leg or hand when they were younger. Only a few times but it did the trick and not probably past the age of seven or eight. I was able to take my children places and people always said they were polite and well behaved in their homes (which was always lovely to hear). I have never degraded them by name calling or swearing which I think is horrendous and will do much more harm in the future than a short sharp smack. Most of my friends brought their children up by the same method. Although I do remember a non smacker whose child would regularly kick the mums shins if annoyed. I think a quick smack would have ended that nonsense :think:

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We have trouble with OH's youngest,

His mum has let him get away with most things and doesn't tell him off: he doesn't say please or thank you,

ignores you when you call him, Has a tantrum if he doesn't like his dinner ( last one was on Christmas day) :oops:

He will call his mum if OH disciplines him (normally taking his DS off him). He had to eat porridge Sunday morning

2hrs, tears and tantrums later he had eaten it (cold :roll: ).

His older brother had OH at home and is growing up into such a lovely lad as he has had the discipline as he was

growing up ( i think the occasional light smack if very naughty).

I think you can do more harm if you swing one way or the other to much, Firm but fair seems to work and

a very scary dog training voice. :twisted:

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Having well behaved children and smacking isnt mutually exclusive which seems to be the opinion of many.

I disagree: having well behaved children (who will grow up to be well-adjusted adults, fit to face to the world and all it's challenges) who understand *degrees* of boundaries are essential for future growth and competency.

 

The majority are not saying "smacking promotes well behaved children". Indeed, they are saying it has been utilised as a last resort in situations of danger.

 

Now, compare that to the "average" Friday/Saturday night, of young adults, out on the town: look at someone the wrong way; sigh in the wrong place; wear the wrong colour; drink one too many; be in the wrong place at the wrong time. Result? A&E if you are lucky; intensive care if you are misfortunate; morgue if you are very unlucky! Why? Because the individual perpetrating the attack did not understand the consequence of societal boundaries. Every human has tolerance limits. Not that I advocate that - just explaining my life experiences.

 

Discipline begins at birth. For some, the "Voice of Doom" will be enough; for some, it will not be enough and other measures will apply. Either way, and without it becoming "abusive", a parent has the option to discipline by degrees and to decide to which degree (without ASSAULT) is deemed necessary. The parent who does not set boundaries is far more lethal then the parent who administers the occasional, infrequent, slap on the bottom.

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Rosie is now 13 and has started to help a friend look after her two small children and to do the odd spot of baby sitting for them too. They have a VERY liberal approach to child discipline and R isn't even allowed to say 'careful' when one of them is doing something dangerous (apparently it sends their minds into a spin and inhibits their natural ability to judge what is dangerous and what is not)... some of the things they do scare the bejaysus out of me and R is beginning to value the discipline that she was brought up with.

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The parent who does not set boundaries is far more lethal then the parent who administers the occasional, infrequent, slap on the bottom.

 

I agree, however my point is it doesn't have to be no boundaries or the use of smacking. Boundaries can be set very firmly and effectively without the use of it and whilst the scenarios you set out can be true, it can be dangerous, especially how young people are portrayed in the media, to believe that all young people behave like this, and as the mother of a very soon to be 18 and 20 yr old sons and the experience of their groups of friends, know there are lots of responsible young people out there.......and we achieved all this without smacking, so more impetus needs to be on effective parenting generally, not necessarily smacking.

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Ok, so most of us think that a little smack on the bottom for doing something dangerous or to snap a child out of a zone, heat of the moment smacks, are acceptable. I think all the smackers seem to be mothers. An interesting point was raised about not needing to smack as an older (more experienced) parent. No one has claimed to be the indulgent, no discipline, screaming parent we all come across in the supermarket. Of all the replies surprisingly only two parents do not smack. My first experience with small children was as a teacher. Maybe this is why I have the view that I do. The 'voice of doom" (Love the expression) and consequences have always worked for me. Oh and the school I taught in had a large number of french children, they where almost ferrel, no discipline at all but lots of smacks, every teacher had been kicked or punched and I was bitten so badly I limped for 2 weeks!

 

So when is a smack not a smack?

 

I have two friends who have been to court to protect their young children from violent fathers. Neither father thinks he has done anything wrong. One even told the judge it was just a cuff over the head. Doctors have seen the damage, the children swear the fathers hit them. The court found that they were hit and the fathers were still given joint residency and unsupervised access to the children. These men think they use suitable force. They are still "smacking" and they believe the courts have vindicated them as they still have access. If smacking was illegal for every one including parents this ambiguity would not hold.

 

The man who took his child away for his smack left a mark. He also grabs him by the scruff and humiliates him in other ways. His children tell anyone who will listen that they hate their parents and today my child said she's now glad she doesn't have a Dad. These people have always been kind and generous to me. They are dear friends and they spend a great deal of time with one of the families mentioned above. One of these very vulnerable children mentioned above is my godchild. I can not just walk away our community is too small. A great many people are upset by their behaviour towards their children. Non of my closest friend smack their children so we are at a loss to understand. They are extreme but how would you who do smack your children make it clear to them that this is unacceptable in a supportive way?

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I did do a two fingered sharp smack on OH youngest hands as he was picking his meat up with his fingers

in a restaurant and he was totally ignoring OH. It worked and i would do that again, I've never full handed

smack them, Taking their beloved Blackberries and laptops seem to do the trick.

Being a step parent isn't easy :roll:

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I would prefer not to smack, I have very unfond memories of being hit as a child, but I have as a last resort smacked Imogen on the bum. Once when she was kicking me in the face while I changed her last week (she is essentially non-verbal at the moment, but knows very well what 'no' means), once a month or so ago when she pushed Teddy over for about the millionth time that day and once when she bit me and wouldn't release her teeth. If I could find another way of communicating effectively that these behaviours weren't acceptable, I would go for it in a shot, I hate that essentially I am responding to violence with violence, and she's still only two and a half. I'm hoping things will get easier when she's talking. Our childminder calls her strong willed, but at the moment I almost believe she doesn't talk on purpose just to avoid having to do what we say.

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I dislike smacking. I remember with extreme distress how terrified I would be of the 'threats' used as a means of controlling my behaviour as a child. I should stress that I was not a particularly difficult child, but, also I was never beaten or smacked simply 'because'.

To my deep and utter shame, I have smacked occassionally. :( To me this shows me that I have lost control of MY behaviour and have let anger take over. I prefer to use the naughty step or removal of priviledges and treats. I always try to follow this up with a discussion about why the behaviour was/is unacceptable or unncessary. Most importantly I do try and find out why they behaved as they did.

We eat out frequently and have been told, on many occassions, by other diners 'how well behaved' our children are. This is a compliment to my children, and I always make sure they know that others have appreciated this.

That said, parenting isn't a science and its something we can only face as it arises.

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I do not have any children so I hesitated to get involved in this thread as I have no experience ofparenting , but I think it is a shame that such empasis is put on smacking. I was smacked as a child on the hand or bottom, only when I had been very naughty and as a last resort. I love my parents and I know that they love me and have done the very best for me that they could throughout my life, so I do not feel that it damaged my relationship with them or hurt me in any way apart fom my pride at the time. Smacking or not smacking is such a small part of parenting and other aspects of it would seem far more important to me.

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I do not have any children so I hesitated to get involved in this thread as I have no experience ofparenting , but I think it is a shame that such empasis is put on smacking. I was smacked as a child on the hand or bottom, only when I had been very naughty and as a last resort. I love my parents and I know that they love me and have done the very best for me that they could throughout my life, so I do not feel that it damaged my relationship with them or hurt me in any way apart fom my pride at the time. Smacking or not smacking is such a small part of parenting and other aspects of it would seem far more important to me.

 

Good point.

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This is an interesting thread, it seems that like us many parents have given the occasional smack as a way of stopping a situation in it's tracks and getting the child's attention, so that more reasoned dicipline can take place.

 

I agree that there are a few people out there who will hurt and humiliate their children, but thankfully they are very much in the minority. I would not have liked it if I had not been allowed to give my children a quick smack when they were small.

 

I have always found that getting down onto their level and using a firm low voice very effective and occasionally the voice of doom. We have brought our children up in a very simialr way to the way that we were brought up and so far they are pretty good :D

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