Is my pekin bantam male or female?

[Olly]

OK, I have asked advice from my local group, and naturally enough got several different answers! I'm not going to say what they were - I thought I'd come on here and see how many more suggestions I could get!

 

I have two supers on my hive - at one point they were filling the lower one up. The second one is the one I extracted earlier in the year, and I put it back so they could clean up the frames and repair the comb. When I looked last week however there is very little capped honey. About 3/4 of the frames in each super have some nectar/honey in, but the frames are very light, and some are empty. I want to tuck my bees up for winter and start feeding/varroa treatment, so what do you recommend I do with these supers?

[Guest]

Type of hive?

 

2 empty supers directly above the brood?

 

How are you expecting to over-winter them?

 

Certainly having two near empty supers is not good.

 

How long have these been on?

 

What varroa treatment are you considering?

 

What are the indications of varroa loading?

 

Location?

 

Strength of colony?

 

Amount of stores in the brood box at this time?

 

The answers to the above questions might make a reply somewhat more meaningful than 'flying in the dark'.

 

I had worked out from your post that about half a super of frames are empty.

 

For a start, that is a regrettable state of affairs to be sorting out at this time of the year. I have an idea of what I might suggest in your scenario, to extricate yourself and the bees from this particular situation, but I doubt I would have any certainty of coming up with an acceptable plan without considering the actual conditions and viable options.

 

RAB

[Olly]

Type of hive?

National

2 empty supers directly above the brood? Yup

How are you expecting to over-winter them? Not sure what you mean - close the hive up and leave it alone, that's what I did last year!

How long have these been on? Since the end of June when I extracted the first crop. At that point there was capped honey in the second super, and I just put the other one back on top so they could repair the comb, which they did. I was expecting another good crop! Then it stopped raining, the nectar flow dried up, and and now there is very little.

What varroa treatment are you considering? Apiguard now, and then oxalic acid in the spring.

What are the indications of varroa loading? Low to moderate.

Location? A sheltered site at the end of my garden, it's surrounded on two sides by a hedge and a wall, and not in a frost pocket.

Strength of colony? Good - I had to requeen earlier in the year after the queen disappeared, but the new queen has been established for a couple of months and is laying well, the brood body has got about seven frames of brood/eggs/larvae.

 

Amount of stores in the brood box at this time? Three frames of stores.

 

Well, "Ooops, word censored!"ody in my local group asked me any of those questions, which might explain why I got so many different suggestions. Why do you say it's regrettable? I certainly regret not getting another crop of honey!

 

I await your thoughts, RAB!

[Guest]

Last question first: Regrettable because it would have been far better not to have had that second super on now we are entering the second week in September, before varroa treatment. It sounds like it possibly should never have gone back on or should have been removed a long time ago.

 

Some of these questions would be obvious to you local beeks, which is why I asked of you location. On the main beekeeping forum there are contributors from the American continent, Italy, Spain, France, Scotland, Wales, Ireland, England, Finland and others. Location can make a huge difference to the suggestions put forward. Even simply assumming the UK there are considerable differences from north to south, or even southwest.

 

Your local beeks would probably have asumed the same type of hive as theirs, as they are probably mostly all using the same type of equipment. The Dartington, for instance is rather different to a WBC, a Lanstroth jumbo, likewise. Forum replies would not have that quaintly assumed, but often incorrect, information to work with. Hardfacts are considerably more useful, or your replies would, hardly surprisingly, likely be even more diverse than those from your locals.

 

Normally, to clean up a super of extracted frames, one does not just put it on top of an existing super for cleaning up and repair. That is precisely what you wrote in your first post, not to be refilled imminently, which is what you have conveniently changed it to. You see, the facts are useful.

 

Perhaps just from these examples you might understand the need for some or all of those questions I posed.

 

Here is my guess on the iformation supplied.

 

Remove supers and do varroa treatment. Feed while doing apiguard treatment (after,say, first week feed. Remove feed after a few days, say five.

 

After apiguard,replace one super containin frames with honey in them. Feed for winter stores as in next para. as approprite.

 

Extract the remaining frames, if worthwhile, and feed back to the bees. Feed 2:1 sugar syrup until it is no longer taken down. Close down for winter.

 

Whether you need a super is not really apparent, with no idea of your actual location, but I always over-wintered on a brood and a super where I live. That was one part of the reason for converting to 14 x 12, but only a small consideration.

 

I suspect that a lot out there will have other ideas, but I expect they are likely to modify theirs now there is more information.

 

The detailed management reasons have been ommitted for simple clarity. They can be supplied on request.

 

RAB

[Old Speckled Hen]

Olly, I have a part drawn/part filled super over one colony which I was going to put under the brood box over winter.

I intend to put empty supers under each and was just going to substitute one for the part filled one. However, following the advice you have been given I'll probably store it and put it on top of the hive next spring.

My thymol treatment is finished and I am feeding and looking forward to the ivy.

[MedusA]

I do realise that there are numerous options available, but as this is what I have been advised by my BKA, I have done this:-

 

I had 3 supers on this year - I extracted 1 earlier and put it back on and another 2, from which I have more recently extracted. I put them back on the hive above a crown board which had the feeder holes mostly blocked off. The bees then do not see them as part of the hive (that's the theory anyway) and "rob" the honey to below the closed down crown board, much in the way they take feed down. Once they were cleaned out, I then took those 2 supers off for storage.

 

The 3rd, partly filled but uncapped, super I have now put below the brood box. If there is a further flow, they have more space for storage and can stock up for the winter. My apiary manager says they will usually eat this first and then move up into the brood stores when they have finished it.

 

I am in the midst of Apiguard treatment and about to start feeding with 2:1 syrup at the moment. I am assured by my BKA that this 3rd super will be usable again next spring and not tainted by the Apiguard. The only crucial thing I need to remember is to take the super off early enough to avoid the queen laying in it next spring.

 

I'll let you know next season if this method works.

[Olly]

Thanks for all the replies! I'm hoping for a dry/warmish day this weekend, when I can decide what to do with them.