4m x 3m Omlet pen, cube, new auto door still boxed and coop light

[thequietman1977]

Hi

 

New user looking for some advice. Im fairly new to hen keeping as well. I used to work offshore and always wanted hens (and ducks but yet to convince the wife this is the way forward!!) I got 5 ex-battery hens in October and after a little bit of adjusting, they settled in fine. They have plenty of space (I think anyway) as basically I split my garden in half and cut down some trees. They have a big enclosed, covered run with around 150 ft2 of roofed space. The coop is also under this area, covered but it is suspended about 2ft off the ground so they can scratch around underneath it. I also have around 200 ft2 of outside space for them which is not roofed.

 

I got 3 new birds around 4/5 weeks ago, a POL Speckledy, a POL Black Rock and a Columbine/Cream Legbar who is probably 2/3 weeks younger than the other 2 new ones. I am having trouble integrating them…….the Cream Legbar is getting really beaten up, to the point where she has a lot of feathers missing on her neck/head!! I followed all the advice I could find on the internet. I borrowed a small coop and a run and put it into the outdoor enclosure of the ex-battery hens (the ginger ninjas we call them) so everybody could see everybody and get used to each other. The usual crowing and clucking to begin with but it calmed down and after 2 weeks I gradually integrated them bit by bit, everybody went for the 3 new ones as to be expected and I let it go on like this hoping it would calm down. Over time, it has settled down to an extent. The Black Rock and Speckledy have settled in now. They occasionally get chased, but they shrug it off and don’t bother. However, the poor little Columbine is absolutely tormented. She doesn’t get much access to food and water due to the bullies, unless im there to hand it to her and she has been in a terrible state. She is terrified, even of me. Blood has been drawn now and I know who the protagonists are. There is one particular hen who seeks her out and ive had enough of her behaviour (I know it’s a natural process and natural instincts, but you do get upset a, bit don’t you). Enough is enough. So this morning I intervened and put the three top hens into the little run on their own to try and give little Daisy some confidence in the big run, away from the top birds. I intend to keep them in there for a week to try and knock the cockiness out of them. If this doesn’t work, I shall fence of my run and let little Daisy have her own little run and perhaps get her a wee pal of the same breed.

 

What do you guys think? Do they not have enough space, have I done right / wrong, is my method correct or do you have anymore suggestions for me? Please can people give me some feedback, both positive and negative? If I have handled it incorrectly I will understand, I am learning after all.

 

Much appreciation in advance

 

Graham

[LottyJ1]

They sound like they have loads of space

Very lucky chooks bless them.

 

I'm afraid you will always get this when introducing new hens espically if you have an existing hen who if bottom of the order as she will try to ensure these new hens dont out rank her - this will be the one who is being the worst to the poor newbie.

 

What you are trying sounds good but you could also try seperating off the bullied one with the top hen for a bit - that way she may become more part of the group. Keep trying.

 

There will be more people on here who know more also and may have some more tips.

[thequietman1977]

What you are trying sounds good but you could also try seperating off the bullied one with the top hen for a bit - that way she may become more part of the group. Keep trying.

 

Thanks for the input, much appreciated. Ive been trying to get them integrated for weeks now and it just seems to be little Daisy, she is really scabby looking and i feel so sorry for her.

 

So you suggesting I put Daisy in with the main protagonist? Seems a bit brutal like. Hmm, food for though though. At the moment the 3 bulliers are seperate from the bullied. Im trying to mess the pecking order up a bit, but it probably wont work. The odd thing is the one who seeks out the newbies isnt bottom of the pecking order, the two who are bottom of the pecking order dont really seem bothered by the newbies, and treat them with complete indifference. Very odd.

[LottyJ1]

Hi,

 

I wouldn't perhaps put her in with the one doing the worst bullying but a top hen who isn't too bad? That way she will have a friend at the top?

 

Just an idea but it always depends on each situation. What your doing now may work well also.

 

I do hope it works out. I always find intro's stressful.

[thequietman1977]

Thanks LottyJ1, ill keep this in mind. If the present plan doesnt work, then I may give it a go.

 

If that doesnt work then the fence goes up and a pal is brought in. Your right about the stress though, ive never been so stressed. Up at ridiculously early times of the day, letting them out and then watching for the fights and splitting them up when it starts getting nasty!! Glas I dont have kids, thats all i can say.

 

Another sapect to think on is the fact that Daisy is so flighty. I sometimes think if she wasnt so on edge and didnt run away everytime someone looked at her she wouldnt be as bad, but in fact her behaviour almost attracts the attention of the other hens and hence they chase her.

[jackian]

They sound like they have loads of space

Very lucky chooks bless them.

 

I'm afraid you will always get this when introducing new hens espically if you have an existing hen who if bottom of the order as she will try to ensure these new hens dont out rank her - this will be the one who is being the worst to the poor newbie.

 

What you are trying sounds good but you could also try seperating off the bullied one with the top hen for a bit - that way she may become more part of the group. Keep trying.

 

There will be more people on here who know more also and may have some more tips.

 

I agree with this..I ended up seperating my bully from the others and it worked ..Took about 3 weeks but all was peacefull in the end.

[thequietman1977]

They sound like they have loads of space

Very lucky chooks bless them.

 

I'm afraid you will always get this when introducing new hens espically if you have an existing hen who if bottom of the order as she will try to ensure these new hens dont out rank her - this will be the one who is being the worst to the poor newbie.

 

What you are trying sounds good but you could also try seperating off the bullied one with the top hen for a bit - that way she may become more part of the group. Keep trying.

 

There will be more people on here who know more also and may have some more tips.

 

I agree with this..I ended up seperating my bully from the others and it worked ..Took about 3 weeks but all was peacefull in the end.

 

When you say you seperated who did you seperate with who and in what circumstances? Were all hens still able to see all hens?

[jimnpaula]

I think your birds have plenty of room and that the current arrangement of separate bullies is probably for the best until Daisy gets less scabby. If she has open wounds, separate Daisy or she could get pecked to death as blood/red attracts pecking. Purple Spray (gentian violet) can disguise any bloody areas and is an antiseptic (use gloves, stains everything) but I would want to keep her apart until any wounds start to heal.

 

Question: are the new girls laying yet? Laying birds are automatically higher up the ranking than non-laying. Therefore they may be in the double whammy situation of being new And non laying.

 

I have found ex batts to be spirited birds with large personalities, but that they learned that they had to fight for everything, and still will.

 

You may need to invest in more food and water containers until they learn to share nicely.

 

Hope any of that helps, and good luck. Let us know how you get on.

 

P

[jackian]

In the end I seperated the bully from the rest. You have more space than me but I had a WIR 6m squared divided in two with two coups . I let them out together to FR at certain times and made sure there were a couple of feeding stations (the bully cant be in two places at once )...Another good tip I am not sure if it has been mentioned but a water pistol loaded at the ready ,each time bully attacks give her a jet of water.

It is really stressful but it does get better.At one stage i had to go round to a neighbour and say sorry as Poppy was protesting and screaming so much .

[thequietman1977]

I think your birds have plenty of room and that the current arrangement of separate bullies is probably for the best until Daisy gets less scabby. If she has open wounds, separate Daisy or she could get pecked to death as blood/red attracts pecking. Purple Spray (gentian violet) can disguise any bloody areas and is an antiseptic (use gloves, stains everything) but I would want to keep her apart until any wounds start to heal.

 

Question: are the new girls laying yet? Laying birds are automatically higher up the ranking than non-laying. Therefore they may be in the double whammy situation of being new And non laying.

 

I have found ex batts to be spirited birds with large personalities, but that they learned that they had to fight for everything, and still will.

 

You may need to invest in more food and water containers until they learn to share nicely.

 

Hope any of that helps, and good luck. Let us know how you get on.

 

P

 

She really is in a state like. Went home from work at lunchtime to check on her and she was happily chomping away on the lettuce i left out for them this morning (they get a letuce a day between 8 of them) surrounded by the other two newbies and the two more docile ex-batts (who were bottom of the pecking order in my opinion) with no problem. Every now and again she gets a smack from one of them, but nothing serious. They tolerate her it seems. Her head and neck is now purple and bereft of feathers in large parts, because I knew that red / blood can bring out the canibal in hens. I see what you mean about the staining (my right hand is also purple !!).

 

None of the new birds have laid a single egg yet. The other two newbies are now around the 25/6 week mark, if what the seller told me was correct. The Columbine is slightly younger, a month behind maybe. But none have laid an egg to my knowledge and i check it umpteen times a day. The ex-batts are mid moult and arent laying either, possibly due to moulting or possible because they are done. At least two of the ex-batts have IB, but they have been vetted and all is fine im told. So out of 8 hens im getting 1, maybe 2 if im lucky a day.

 

What i had also done in recent days is open up the whole garden to everyone and then if someone did chase daisy she had planty space to run......didnt work, Maureen (She has red feathers and a green leg band so is named after Maureen O'Hara) just spent the whole day stalking her. They are now all contained within the two runs.

[thequietman1977]

In the end I seperated the bully from the rest. You have more space than me but I had a WIR 6m squared divided in two with two coups . I let them out together to FR at certain times and made sure there were a couple of feeding stations (the bully cant be in two places at once )...Another good tip I am not sure if it has been mentioned but a water pistol loaded at the ready ,each time bully attacks give her a jet of water.

It is really stressful but it does get better.At one stage i had to go round to a neighbour and say sorry as Poppy was protesting and screaming so much .

 

If it comes to it, I have the space to seperate them and could easily knock up a little coop and fence off a portion for Daisy and A.N.other. At the weekend i knocked up a little mini open ended run with chicken wire on one half and a solid lifting roof on the other side as a feed station to keep pellets dry. I did this because the birds seemed to like roosting on the spare coop/run i use for introducing them. I had borrowed it from someone at work, but it is a good design so though id nick the idea of the run for a dry house (with Daisy in mind because she doesnt like going in the big run for obvious reasons.

 

Also, i like the water pistol idea. Maybe i go one step further and get the hose out. Na, better stick to the water pistol. I had been using a broom to keep them apart, but a non physical intervention seems a better idea.

[jimnpaula]

She really is in a state like. Went home from work at lunchtime to check on her and she was happily chomping away on the lettuce i left out for them this morning (they get a letuce a day between 8 of them) surrounded by the other two newbies and the two more docile ex-batts (who were bottom of the pecking order in my opinion) with no problem. Every now and again she gets a smack from one of them, but nothing serious. They tolerate her it seems.

 

It sounds like this arrangement is working then. I'd suggest waiting for Daisy to recover from her injuries and gain confidence within the 'mild' flock before re-introducing the others - let them glare at each other through a fence for a week or more...

 

P

[thequietman1977]

She really is in a state like. Went home from work at lunchtime to check on her and she was happily chomping away on the lettuce i left out for them this morning (they get a letuce a day between 8 of them) surrounded by the other two newbies and the two more docile ex-batts (who were bottom of the pecking order in my opinion) with no problem. Every now and again she gets a smack from one of them, but nothing serious. They tolerate her it seems.

 

It sounds like this arrangement is working then. I'd suggest waiting for Daisy to recover from her injuries and gain confidence within the 'mild' flock before re-introducing the others - let them glare at each other through a fence for a week or more...

 

P

 

I tried this arrangement before, however, i only left it for 3 days or so before trying them and then it started again. I will let her find her feet for the next week to 10 days with the 'mild' flock as you say and then try it. If it is not really working still then ill rethink, unless someone can come up with other suggestions.

[laurmurf]

if you have a younger and flightier hen who is getting picked on then I'd plan on separating them out for a long time until the flightier columbine has matured a bit and gained in confidence.

 

I tend to take months on my intros and not weeks - i don't hold with the 'there's always a bit of bother, it can't be helped' theory: i believe intros should be absolutely painless and squawk-free and if that takes 3 months, then that's how long it takes....

 

my advice would be to take a few steps back, as you have, create two flocks from your existing hens and let them live side by side but not together. Go into it assuming that this is the way it will be for months and then when it's shorter than that, you'll be happier.

[thequietman1977]

my advice would be to take a few steps back, as you have, create two flocks from your existing hens and let them live side by side but not together. Go into it assuming that this is the way it will be for months and then when it's shorter than that, you'll be happier.

 

This was the type of response I was expecting, taking a step back and slow the process down. There does not seem to be a quick way to do it and why would there be. Sound advice, but you say it would be that way for months, but at what point are you trying again with the putting together. Do you try it putting them together like a specific day every week to see if they are ready or do you just get a sense of when it is ok?

[Egluntyne]

Some advice on managing intros here.

[thequietman1977]

Just an update on Daisy's progress.

 

She has completely changed in the last 24 hours since the bullies were seperated. She has suddenly decided she is a strutting bird, making alot of noise and pushing others out the way to get to the food. Im hoping when i reintroduce the others in 10 days or so she keeps up the attitude. I like it. Small hen syndrome.

 

I like her style. I watched her from the kitchen window earlier. She jumped onto the little 'bullies' run, jumped onto the fence seperating their run from the rest of the garden, negotiated her way along that, slowly, stopping momentarily to eat the heads of my wifes hydrangea (I wont tell her that), climb onto the roof of the run which is about 7 feet in height, walk along that and hop down onto the outside table and down onto the grass. It was like the Great Escape. Excellent.