Part 0800.0005

[Egghead68]

Hi,

 

I posted earlier in the week about my Rhode Star who laid two white eggs (Tues and Weds last week) then reverted to her usual brown. She has also had diarrhoea since last Monday. I thought I saw her sneeze so brought her (and the other two as they get very stressed if they are separated) indoors on Tuesday evening. Since then I have been able to monitor her droppings more closely. Basically they consist of either (a) clear/white liquid or (b) undigested mash. I am now sure whether she is also sneezing but she is shaking her head in a twisting motion every 10 minutes or so. She is eating/drinking/laying/behaving normally but I am concerned. II am keeping her warm, and feeding her a plain diet of mash, plain water and live yoghurt with Nutribal supplement (usually she gets ACV, greens and treats but have cut these out except a grape twice a day). She was wormed a month ago. Any ideas what could be wrong or how I could be helping her better? Should I isolate her from the others even though it will stress them all? Should I give her Baytril (I have about 3 days worth)?

 

I have an appointment with a chicken vet but this is not until Saturday morning (first one I could get with a specialist and the general vets are clueless).

[The Dogmother]

What did you worm her with?

[Egghead68]

Flubenvet. Can give another another course but don't want to do it while she's on antibiotics (if she needs them).

[The Dogmother]

No, I wouldn't repeat it, I just wondered what you'd wormed them with. That's fine.

 

TBH, I'd get her to the vet. This is not something that I have experience with.

[sandyhas3chucks]

what does her crop feel like?

Is it empty in the morning.

retfords are god reasonable cost and fast if you send a poo sample, you should have an answer by the end 6/7 days

[Egghead68]

Crop is emptying and filling normally and her appetite is good. Thank you very much for the Retfords suggestion. I will send off a sample.

[Plum]

The head movement could indicate gapeworm which needs double strength dose so would be worth getting the vet to check.

[Egghead68]

Thanks Plum. They are all off to the chicken vet first thing tomorrow morning.

[Plum]

Good luck, let us know how it goes

[Egghead68]

Will do. Thanks everyone for your help.

[Lewis]

Also interested to hear how you get on.

 

Good luck at the vets

[sandyhas3chucks]

good luck

[Egghead68]

Thanks everyone!

[Egghead68]

Well I'm not much the wiser after the trip to the vets (exciting drive through snowstorm). She told

me to worm them again and gave me baytril for the one with diarrhoea. She is not that concerned about the snicking/sneezing as their air sacs are clear, there is no nasal discharge and no signs of listlessness. Their weights are all stable. I'm to monitor them all and go back and see the head chicken vet if there's no improvement this week.

 

Maybe Retfords will come up with something. I'll update here if so.

[Lewis]

How odd if you've already wormed them

 

Hopefully Retfords will have an answer

[sandyhas3chucks]

not really. If you read the info on the website it will explain it all.

I often haver to reworm my girls and recently a test from retfords for someone i know came back positive despite recent worming, not sure which method she uses for dosing...????

there were other things to, she was mortified!!

[Egghead68]

Just to let you know I have had the result back from Retfords:

No parasites. Low levels of brachyspira bacteria. Low levels of other bacteria. The lady said that they will all need a course of tiamulin fumarate antibiotics.

[Egghead68]

Some information on Brachyspira, which it turns out is increasingly common in wild birds:

 

The long-term effect of brachyspira infections is soft droppings, which may stain eggs, cause pasty vents in the bird and result in wet litter. But the chronic debilitating effect of the infection is a reduction in egg production, bodyweight and possible increase in mortality.

 

The drop in egg production can occur as they approach peak if the infection is early, or just after peak or any time after then as the infection builds up in the bird. With B pilosicoli, there can be a 5-6% drop in egg production and with B intermedia, it can be as high as 10-12%, which would completely ruin a flock’s productivity.

 

Some producers have reported an increase in pale eggs as well, probably due to poorer nutrition. The infection can last for several months if birds are left untreated.

 

There can be a 0.2kg drop in hen weight, so this is also a useful parameter to monitor.

 

Mortality usually creeps up. It is not a sudden increase, but almost a doubling or trebling of mortality from 0.5% per month to 1-1.5% per month.

 

Mortality is not always associated with anything in particular, but is thought to be due to the generalised debilitation of the hen and there is often an increase in egg peritonitis caused by E coli. Obviously these lost hens cannot be replaced, again reducing the overall efficiency of a shed, if allowed to continue over a long period.

 

From http://www.fwi.co.uk/academy/article/115997/brachyspira-in-laying-hens.html

[Egghead68]

Their vet says that a double dose of Tylan will get rid of the problem in most cases too. He has not had to use Denegard (tiamulin fumarate - v. expensive).

Edited December 1, 2010 by Guest

[Plum]

Good news, that was worth it

[Egghead68]

Well after worming with flubenvet, one week on baytril, two weeks on double strength tylan and one week on tiamulin (and several hundred pounds spent on vet and test bills) my girls are no better. In fact one has lost .2kg and one seems to have become lethargic and lost her appetite. They are on anti-fungals now because of the prolonged antibiotic treatment and because the full report from Retfords, that came last week, showed Candida. II have sent off for Avipro and for throat swab kits from Retfords.

 

Does any one have any ideas what this could be or what else I can do help?

My fear is avian TB. Could it also be the Candida causing this? They saw avian vet yesterday. He has prescribed additional tylan injections in case it is mycoplasma but this is clutching at straws.

 

To recap - sudden onset of watery diarrhoea in previously well 1 year old chicken, followed by onset of snicking one week later and spread to other two in the flock within 1-2 weeks. Behaviour, laying pretty normal with exception of two pale eggs from the first bird initially and now lethargy and depressed appetite in oldest bird. Mild weight loss in one bird. Baytril, tylan and tiamulin all led to a slight improvement in the diarrhoea while the birds were on them but this relapsed when they were stopped. Tiamulin possibly led to a slight decrease in the snicking.

[Egghead68]

I am also wondering if any of this could have been caused by eating mouldy mash (I dumped their old mash on the compost heap but they got at it and ate loads of it).