My eco solution to rat problems

[redfrock]

While we were on holiday Andy suddenly piped up that he had been thinking for some time that it would actually be a good idea for me to have a dog (I have been wanting one since I left home 12 years ago and have remained strong willed)

 

I bought a superb book while away (New Dog - Bruce Fogle, highly recommend it) and had a good read. We got home yesterday and I popped into our vet and booked an appointment to see her to have a chat.

 

Good long chat with vet today. She is well versed in our set up and lifestyle, having seen most of the menagerie, including 3 of the hens, at some time. She is also very knowledgeable and talked through the different kinds of dogs and why they would not be suitable given our set up ie. most of them!

 

However she did come up with two solutions - a Cavalier King Charles Spaniel and, even more surprisingly, a Doberman . Andy is not particularly keen on the CKCS, he would rather something a bit bigger! I must admit I prefer the other types of Spaniel. I have always been terrified of Dobermans following an incident as a child, but the vet was very reassuring and explained that they are 'taught aggression' rather than inherently aggressive. She would also be able to put me in touch with breeders who use the surgery for both breeds, so she knows the history and backgrounds. She advised against a rescue dog (my first choice) or an adult dog, saying that a puppy would learn to integrate with everybody better.

 

The best bit is that she said she had absolutely no concerns about us having a dog as she considered us to be very responsible pet owners and believe me this is high praise indeed as she is well known for not being a 'people person' and will tell you exactly how it is when it comes down to your pet. I now know why we get on fine with her

 

So I guess the reason for the ramble is to ask if anybody has any experience with Dobermans? I have had my cat for 10 years and his well being is paramount, and my primary concern. There is no rush for me to have a dog, I have waited this long and would rather wait until Ollie has passed (something I hope is a very long time away) rather than upset or distress him. We also have other animals in the house. I have said that if we do get a Doberman it will have to be a chocolate and tan one (beautiful) rather than the black and tan as that is too big a reminder.

[victoriabunny]

I haven't owned a doberman myself, but I share your instinctive worry about the breed and wouldn't own one for that reason. I know that in the right hands they are lovely dogs, but it seems to me that a dog's instinctive behaviour is determined by the characteristics it was bred for - and dobes are a guarding breed. I'm sure careful training would suppress the instinct in them, but it seems to me that it's better to work with a dog's natural tendencies rather than against them. You wouldn't own a terrier and expect it not to chase rats. I do like dobes and they are beautiful dogs, but personally the only guarding breed I'd consider owning would be a GSD (not sure why I'd be happy with that and not a dobe - they're just more well-rounded to me, somehow). I'd be hesitant about a Weimeraner for a similar reason. I'm sure there are plenty of doberman owners who will come on and tell me I don't know what I'm talking about and their dog is the most gentle and sweet creature, and they're probably right - it's just my opinion. Personally, my dogs so far have all been crosses from the dogs' home, but I would like to own a pedigree in the future and will probably go for a cocker or standard poodle - I just love them.

[chelsea]

no experience with dobermans, but my friend has a KC spaniel which is adorable and she has a young family - a lovely dog.

[jess8619]

My singer teacher has a King Charles Spaniel and he's very cute and chubby and likes to come and sing with us.

 

My friend used to have a doberman, but it had to be put down, he was very friendly but quite protective of the family and barked everytime he heard/saw planes or hot air balloons.

[lisa33]

I've never had a doberman but both the dobermans I knew where gorgeous.

 

Not at all aggresive but very stupid.

[Seagazer]

My brother had a doberman who had lots of problems but he came from a rescue centre with the problems so I can't say if it was the breed or whatever had happened to him before. They stuck with him for quite a long time but in the end took him back.

 

All breeds of dogs can have problems - its a tricky thing to be able to choose the right dog for you and your situation.

 

I wonder if the fact that you had a bad experience with a dobe might alter the way you would react with the dog if you got it? It would sense your apprehension. After the rescue dog we had briefly before Cookie, bit me, I knew and she knew that I was scared. She kept squaring up to me after that and we had to take her back.

 

Good luck in your choice though.

[redfrock]

Thanks for all the good advice. I knew I could depend on my omleteers to give me their opinions. Good point seagazer about the apprehension. I am hoping that by getting a puppy, and by going for the chocolate coloured version I wouldn't be fearful. Also I would take it to training classes so that I learnt how to behave with the pup and she learnt how to behave with me.

 

I think Andy quite likes the idea of a guard dog because he goes away so frequently, leaving me at home on my own.We are certainly not going to rush into anything as we have to do what is right by all the animals, including the dog, and I am currently considering a career change which would have an impact on having a dog.

[xChicken04x]

Never had any experience of them. In my 'What Dog?' book it says.

 

Attitude to other dogs: Poor

Quietness: Average

Not destructive: Average

Protective behaviour: Excellent

Not Likely to stray: Average

Good with children: Good

Ease of training: Good

 

How suitable are they as family dogs?

 

A well trained doberman makes a wonderful family dog, but a lot of work needs to be put in to training. Affectionate and protective, he enjoys being part of family life. Adolescent Dobes are rowdy and need constant supervision to ensure they do not play too roughly for children and the breed is not recommended for inexperienced homes with vulnerable young children.

 

What type of owner?

 

Not a breed for novices, nor couch potatoes, the Dobe needs an experienced, strong-willed, active and patient owner with plenty of time for him. He also needs company and should not be left considered if he is to be left alone for long periods. A suitable owner will be able to provide confident leadership and plenty of affection for this strong, yet sensitive breed.

 

How good with other pets?

 

Dobes are good with other pets in the same household if raised with them, but be careful about introductions. Strange cats are likely to be regarded are a fair game. Socialization with other dogs is essential and males can often be aggressive to other males.

 

How much exercise?

 

A great deal. These are active energetic dogs that need at least two walks per plus an hours free running a day, as well as exercise for their minds in the form of challenging training.

 

How easy to train?

 

Dobes are highly intelligent and highly trainable, but need calm confident leadership. They are quick to learn and full of initiative and often one step ahead of the handler. A confrontational approach will lead to problems: owners need to earn respect with a firm but sympathetic approach, using reward-based training to motivate the dog to want to learn.

 

 

Sorry I don't have time to write out the whole page, but I picked the best questions. I will try and do the rest tonight. The book I'm quoting from is called "What Dog?" by Amanda O'Neill. Fantastic book, about different dogs split up into sections by their size. Thoroughly recommended.

 

xx

[Rhapsody]

I think any guarding breed would be a good choice as they do not have the chase instinct and would leave your other critters alone. My American Bulldog is a lovely dog, we got him at 18 months from Battersea Old Winsor he is gentle and loving and doesnt chase anything (even the wild rabbits and squirrels) and is the best guard dog I've ever had. We have had no issues with temperament, he is fantastic and I would have another one no question.

If I've piqued your interest here's a pic of one-

 

 

Mine is the size of a Rottweiler, but leggier.

[Gamebird]

Sorry, I have no expereince of Dobermans but I do think that with any dog it comes down to how it is trained and how good the handler is.

 

Socialising them from puppies is so important so they get used to other dogs, people and all sorts of situations at an early age.

 

Obviously, I am biased towards Labradors. Although he is a retriever he does not chase the chickens, wild rabbits or even the resident cock-pheasant and his hens. He even allows the chickens to peck at his bone while he is eating it.

Sorry, any excuse to post pictures of my dog and chickens.

 

Good luck with your decision Redfrock.

[redfrock]

your dogs are beautuful! Decisions decisions decisions!

[hanson]

Again, no experience of Dobermans but I have a Rottweiler.

 

I had a similar experience to you and I was scared by a Rottweiler at a very young age but after much persuasion from OH decided to get a puppy. I didn't enjoy his puppy hood for 1 second because I was always training him. But now, I can enjoy the rest of his life as he has turned into the loveliest dog.

 

I was worried about Fred's reaction to the new chooks but with gentle introductions he has been great, very enchanted by them and just gazes at them while they roam around the garden.

 

So, do think about it seriously but generally I agree that it's sometimes the handler, not always the dog.

[KitG]

Am hoping that this is a suitable area for advice! I have 3 cats and 3 chickens. Cats arrived first and were curious about the chickens when they arrived but were quickly put in their place by Thelma, Louise and Ellie. Cats now have healthy respect for chickens. Last Saturday saw the arrival of Hiccup, a 9 week old yellow labrador. He thinks the chickens are there for him to chase. We are going to be starting one to one training with a professional dog trainer once he has had all his shots. I had assumed that the chickens would see him off in the same way they did the cats. Unfortunately they are now so tame that they just rush up to me as usual and then end up rushing off again if Hiccup decides to pursue them. Books say that they will peck an inquisitive puppy on the nose which should deter them. How do I persuade them to do this? All guidance on socialising the menagerie much appreciated!

[redfrock]

Hi Kit I cannot recommend the 'new Dogs' book by ? Fogle enough. It is absolutely superb and should answer all your questions. From what I understand the best thing to do is keep the puppy on the lead when introducing him to the chooks, so he gets used to the. However have to say that I wanted a lab but my Vet advised against it as they are a gin dog breed and therefore it is in their nature to chase and retrieve - even though they are soppy as hell.

 

We have decided we shall be getting a Doberman, and our vet is thrilled! She is going to put us in touch with a chocolate brown breeder when we are ready. Turns out she has a simialr menagerie to us, inlcuidng a Dobie . Now we have simply got to decide when (if) it is the right time for us