Is my pekin bantam male or female?

[landgirl]

I’d be grateful for advice on pecking order establishment. This is going to be a long one. Are you sitting comfortably? Then I’ll begin…

 

I’ve kept hens for 6 years now (Eglu Classic), but I’ve had Warren (Gingernut Rangers) each time and have had no trouble at all with pecking/bullying etc. Life has been a breeze! I’ve recently upgraded to a Cube with Omlet's Walk-in Run and, a fortnight ago (having given my elderly girls to a friend for a happy retirement), I bought four new Warren pullets, all of whom have rapidly come into lay, (Bluebell, Buttercup, Poppy and Lettuce (ka Letty) – their names match the colours of their ankle rings! ) plus a Cuckoo Maran bantam called Cookie (she’s started to crouch, but is not laying so far and presumably may wait until the spring) and a Buff Orpington called Buffy - yes, I’m THAT good at inventing names, . Buffy is a little younger than the others, has a negligible pink comb and I presume may now not lay until Spring. At the breeders, the hens were penned according to breed, so the Warrens will have known each other, up to a point in a pen of 30 odd hens, and Cookie and Buffy will have been in separate pens with their breeds. I put them all straight in together when we got home and did not do a phased introduction between the breeds - was that my first mistake? [All photos are clickable thumbnails, so you can click for bigger versions if you want.]

From the minute they were put in together in my walk-in run the Warrens rapidly established who were the bosses, and they do have their own internal pecking order, but it’s irrelevant, really, as it’s their treatment of the other two – and my reaction to it – that I’d like some help on. I'm not about to describe the worst bullying you've ever heard of, there are long periods where no pecking occurs and everyone goes about their business, but....

I’m aware that the best thing to do is make sure there are plenty of grubs/glubs available, so even the under-hens can get to food and water and that I must just weather the whole thing as it will blow over. I’ve tried to do this for over a fortnight now but, before the hens arrived, I installed two roosting bars in the run thinking it would be fun and a good use of the space and, immediately, Cookie and Buffy started staying up on the bars all day as they soon realised that this reduced the pecking to one hen at a time whereas each time they ventured onto the run floor, at least 2 and sometimes all 4 Warrens would give them what for until they jumped up on the roosts again, so they never, by choice, get down on the floor at all now and spend their days moving around from food to water and from one perch to another until a Warren gets up on the bars with them and the other two gently (sometimes hurriedly) edge out of the way or (photo below) climb on a willing arm if it will get them out of harm’s way! Ironically, Cookie the (quite large) bantam is more able to cope, she is swift and gets out of harm's way quite neatly and can even fly from one roost to the next whereas Buffy just edges away or cowers til it's over.

 

Just to complicate things it became apparent reasonably quickly that Buffy had brought a respiratory infection with her (which seems not to be catchy as the others are fine). She became increasingly ruttley/sneezy and a bit snotty. I’ve had her to the vets and she’s on anti-biotics, which are working, but it’s not like the poor girl has been feeling on top of the world (although she is eating fine). Also, as is common with her breed, she is the silliest, softest most appealing bag of feathers you ever did see and she makes heart-breaking sounds when she gets pecked, such that I have to fight the urge to take her to work with me where I’m sure she’d happily do all my filing and share my packed (pecked) lunch!

 

I have since installed 3 more roosting bars and they therefore have 4 height levels to play with and I’ve even attached a tray so that Buffy and Cookie can scratch and bathe.

So they’ve become the 'sky birds' and they are even reluctant to put themselves to bed, so, except for a couple of nights, I’ve had to put them in the coop by hand each night and I usually have to get Buffy up in the morning by hand as well. (I work full time, so this is not ideal!)

So, here’s the question (if I still have any readers left after such a loooong post!) I don’t think things are improving or really changing at all and I feel that in trying to help I’ve created a stand-off. Should I let things carry on as they are - sit it out longer and see what happens - or should I, however reluctantly, remove the roosting bars so that they are all down on the ground and HAVE to sort things out between them as I would like B and C to lead a more normal life. Or has anyone got any other suggestions not mentioned here?

 

Any and all advice gratefully received.

Landgirl

[merlina]

I'm no expert and am sure someone will be along soon who knows more - but just wanted to say what lovely hens and what a lovely set-up you have!

 

We know that 'hen dynamics' change when they come into lay and that may well be part of the issue at the moment. It doesn't sound too awful - my inclination would be to leave things as they are while keeping an eye on things

 

(I definitely wouldn't take the roosts out, until everyone is of laying age, it's not really a level playing field for them)

[sjp]

the pecking order cab take a while to establish so 2 weeks isn't that long but from the photos your run set up is very good the 2 younger birds have plenty of room to get away from the other 4 and as long as no blood is drawn and they are eating and drinking them hold your nerve, it partly down to the fact that the birds came from different pens and the age of the 2 younger ones but once they start to lay they should be ok. the warrens will be a bit 'hard' as they will have come from an environment were they have had to 'fight' for their place at the food stations from day one so they don't know any difference as for how you did the intro I'm not sure I'd have done it any different as they all come from the same place I've but girls in with my 2 main mobs that have had the same stand offs and the mob have known the new ones since they were a couple of days old and it's taken 4-6 weeks for them to be accepted the I've put others in that fitted in over night my monies on the maran and orpie ending up towards the top of the pecking order one tip those 2 lengths of 3x2 timber they would be better turned so that the deeper face is up right it'll make the perch stronger and it'll be easier for them to grip

[Egluntyne]

It generally looks worse than it is. They say that if you intervene, it resolves in three weeks, and if you don't it will take 21 days.

 

I'd have extra food and water receptacles. You have given them the means of escaping any unwanted attention by providing extra perches, so it should calm down eventually.

[landgirl]

You kind folk don't hang around do you!? Very reassuring advice already - but please keep it coming, anyone else

 

Just one quick word on the perches...

 

those 2 lengths of 3x2 timber they would be better turned so that the deeper face is up right it'll make the perch stronger and it'll be easier for them to grip

 

These are just random bits of timber from my garage and everything is long-side facing up, if it can be, but a couple are just square fence posts from my old hen fencing and another two are door architraves with the bevel facing downwards! Now that I am reassured about keeping the perches I will instal better versions in due course. Buffy, who is more clumsy toddler than ballet dancer, loves the very wide plank and uses it like a motorway down to the scratching tray

 

I'm really pleased that replies above mention things may well change when the other two come into lay. I now feel comforted that sitting it out is the right thing to do. There are a lot of food/drink stations, more than the photos show. Buffy can reach at least one of each at all times and Cookie flies to them if she really wants to.

 

Now if I can just stop Letty (CURRENT Top Hen) pecking my ankles so blinkin' much! ....

 

Thanks again, this is great

Landgirl.

[Luvachicken]

You certainly do have some lovely girls in there and a fantastic run set up.

I can't offer much advice myself because I had to separate my two nasty girls from my others.

Yours do have a lot of escape routes and fun things to do.

I hope they soon sort themselves out.

[jackian]

Like your other replies I agree that I reckon you should hang on in there .

I have introduced new girls twice and the first time it was 5 weeks before peace reigned and the second time 4 weeks.

I remember the first time feeling near to tears as I thought "What have I done these poor girls don't deserve to come here and being treated like this" If no blood is drawn I would let it go.

If there is one really nasty girl who is leading the others on in her little gang you could separate her for a few days but still being able to see the others.

Love your set up and your girls are Beautiful.

Jackie x

[landgirl]

Thank you all so much for your constructive and kind answers. They've been immensely helpful. I now feel I can relax and let it all happen and won't, now, keep second guessing myself.

 

jackian- it had never even occurred to me to remove the pecker, rather than the peckee, so that opened my eyes somewhat. It's a bit academic as I have no other run available and am now flat broke having bought the Cube/WIR But I've stored this thought away for future need

 

As much as I can tell there has not only been no blood drawn, I don't think there are even feathers flying - so I'm quite aware that this is only fairly light 'bullying' compared to what so many other people have had to go through with their girls. My main concern was really just whether I had created a 'them and us' situation that I needed to reverse, but I can quite see I just need to let them get on with it and let time, and the advent of Buffy and Cookie starting to lay, to work their magic.

 

As soon as I can make a video of all six of them down on the floor, happily foraging, I will come back and update this page!

 

Thanks so much, Landgirl.

[PoachedPlease]

Your perching bars are amazing. Great fun for the chickens! My 2 pols also tend to stay on the perches, both in the run and the wooden coop as the top chicken is a big old light sussex and cant get up to the bars so easily. It really does take weeks and weeks. For us the group Free ranging did the trick. That's when they have a chance to bond over my trashed geraniums or yet another blimin dust bath in the lavender!! However as mine are different ages I just can't imagine them all ever being best buddies.

 

 

Xx

[Ain't Nobody Here]

No other advice to add but wanted to say what a lovely setup . Love the high rise feeding stations .