buffie Posted January 16, 2006 Share Posted January 16, 2006 (edited) I've had another sleepless night worrying about introducing Lottie to Harrie and Charlie . I have had her for 2 weeks and they have seen her dutring the day through wire mesh. We have re built the eglu run and attached to the eglu so all girls will be safely enclosed. The existing larger run is not covered. I plan to put Lottie in the eglu tonight after they have been in 'bed' for about half an hour and at their bop bop stage (sleep sounds ) I will get up at 7 before light and check and let out at dawn. Some of you have done this and do you think it's ok to do this. What to expect is another worry. Charlie has been allowed to pop in to visit Lottie and generally ok but then has a peck at the back of Lotties neck. Concerned I don't know how much is ok and how much isn't ok. Just thought this would be the best place to express these concerns BBx Edited January 16, 2006 by Guest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Frugal Posted January 16, 2006 Share Posted January 16, 2006 Hi Buffie, I had exactly the same worries when we introduced Izzy, the poor little skittish Speckledy to the Velociraptors last May. We kept her apart from them for a week but made sure that their food bowls were parallel with each other with a partition between so they got used to feeding together. She was popped into the Eglu every night through the Eggport but separated during the day. After a week, we let her in with the others and it was horrible. They, Clarry in particular, went for her at every possible opportunity but she found that she could jump up onto the Eglu run and used to escape up there when things got too tough. It took about 3 weeks for them to stop pouncing on her and pinning her down to peck her but she didn't sustain anything more than a few tiny nicks on her comb during these attacks so it's more awful to watch than anything really. She's now very much at the bottom of the pecking order and still gets put in her place by Jenny who is head hen but they're all friends - albeit fair weather when there's something tasty in the run!! Good luck Buffster. Persevere. Intervene only when Lottie is distressed or if they are really hurting her as you'll never introduce her properly if you stop them every time they pick on her. She's got to go through it to find her place in the pecking order. Hopefully she'll be submissive from the start and things will get sorted out quickly. We're shoulders to lean on if it's tough so don't suffer alone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffie Posted January 16, 2006 Author Share Posted January 16, 2006 Oh thanks for that kate, feel happier . I get distressed at seeing the bullying and pecking. It feels cruel to subject them all to a harrowing experience. I am not sure if I will seperate tomorrow or start the process. Could do with someone doing it for me so i don't have to watch. Not usually a wimp in these situations but learnt something else about myself through the girls! BBx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 16, 2006 Share Posted January 16, 2006 I think however much you prepare for it, they still have to establish a pecking order. So she could still get a right beaking no-matter what happens. I was edgey about introducing our White Star to the other two, but it was kind of Ok. There was a few pecks and then some real squaring up and even some feet involved at one point, but after a few days they were all happy and the White Star turned out to be the 'top bird'. I think you might just have to introduce her and let them get on with it, but keep a very close eye on things. If you've got a few hours to kill then stay with them. Of course, I've only done this once, so all the experience I can speak from is just that one time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffie Posted January 16, 2006 Author Share Posted January 16, 2006 Thanks for your advice everyone. Right she's in Left them outside run until it was the type of light that makes them eager to get in to the eglu. Let Charlie in with lottie and she went straight into eglu, Lottie came to the door as she is used to coming in with me! Picked her up and then let harrie in and after a ponder at the door she went in. Took Lottie straight to egg port and popped her in used my large head to fill the eggport hole and watched the process. Lottie wanted harrie to cuddle, she tried snuggling under her wing and then under all of her and then they were both in the nest Lottie hasn't really roosted before so the nest is the obvious choice. harrie then decided to let Lottie have the nest and settled down on the bars. Charlie also settled and checked them twice and snoring nicely although Lottie snuggles me because she did it with me every night for last 2 weeks, even got up very late for cuddles Miss her tonight but got daisie to snuggle. All seems well for part one and think I can leave them alone tonight. Mikey has pointed out that chickens aren't meant to sleep in our bedroom Suppose that's quite right and she is the luckiest girl having her snazzy new house, wonder where she would have ended up if she'd gone to market...hate to think Tomorrow I may have to work and iron in the run! Highly recommend intro's in winter as they go to bed early and wake up later, this would be harder in the summer with so many hours to keep a watch on them. BBx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffie Posted January 19, 2006 Author Share Posted January 19, 2006 The first full night in eglu and today the intro. Have posted for advice as I am really not sure when you intervene. I realsie that doing it because I find it upsetting is not helping the process. I figure that once I've been through the process it'll be fine but I have to say it's not nice to watch. Lottie is almost pleading to be removed, feel dreadful and cruel BBx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Frugal Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 It's horrible, Buffie. I remember my heart aching for poor little Izzy but if she's not being injured or seems really distressed, don't intervene because it will just prolong things and you'll be going through this for weeks and weeks. If she's being pecked, she'll be OK so long as she's got somewhere to run to - Izzy used to hide in a corner with her head down so that they couldn't peck her comb or face or she'd jump onto the top of the run if they were out in the garden. If they're drawing blood, there are lots of anti-peck sprays available, Stockholm Tar to put on wounds to deter pecking and wound powder if she's hurt badly. Try to be brave and watch from a distance, only intervening if it's obviously causing her injury or distress. I really feel for you as I know how hard it is to watch but she will find her place and the others will accept her. Big hug! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffie Posted January 19, 2006 Author Share Posted January 19, 2006 Thanks kate, feel like I've stuck her in the lions den. It's reassuring to know you've done this before and seen it. I will take Daisie out and I think me keeping too close an eye makes it worse. Charlie has stopped pecking her as she has assumed 2nd in command. Interesting to watch in the eglu how the pecks go round. First night 1 peck from Harrie for Charlie and then a peck from Charlie to Lottie. Last night Charlie knew she was in position 2 and so Harrie had a peck for Lottie. BBx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicola H Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Buffie I feel for you it is hard to watch I found it was easier to introduce them if they were freeranging so that Bunty could keep away from the other 2 and they soon forgot to peck her when they were foraging for worms...............It is the food thing, that is the hardest to watch I still feel sorry for little Bunty because she is aways last to get at the treats I some times lock Babs and ginger in the run so that Bunty can have treats from my hand with out being bullied........Good luck it will get better and we are all here to help. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel (& Paul) Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Good luck Buffie! We had lots of pecks when the newbies joined us - but they were always able to run away. When we give them their evening corn we have trained them to go into their own run, so we can shut them in to enjoy their corn without being bullied. I am sure things will help - and yes, when Jerry was the bottom of the "pack" we used to take her to a different part of the garden, where the others couldnt get to and feed her on all sorts of treats etc. Do keep us updated and lots of cyber hugs going out to you and yours Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Sorry and thanks. It was pure panic this morning and thought if I posted in a sort of urgent way someone would find me. Want to swear **** I found it hard but have returned and let my girls into eglu they raced in to lay and took just a couple of minutes but shut them in and lottie bravely had water and pecked at cabbage and had some corn She can't be too bad and no blood She has been allowed to move a few steps and rase her head so phew for now. Feel like I'm more relaxed but my goodness I've learnt something today. It has to be seen to be believed I reckon and don't read about the most terrible things can happen or you don't sleep for days like me. Thanks you lot you've helped so much and feel abit now but will update as the day goes on and hope tonight is ok. I'm glad I've done it and will sleep better tonight. BBx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Frugal Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Treats are easy. Throw some to one end of the run so the two original greedy gutses shoot over there and while they're tucking in, put a few at the other end for Lottie. We had ours in a bigger run when Izzy was introduced and it was easy to get Jenny and Clarry eating at one end while hand feeding or putting things at the other end for Izzy to eat. Tomorrow will be better and the day after will be even betterer ! Honest. It won't seem like it at the time but you will look back and think yes, it was. It's hard work and so, so painful to watch this poor little hen being picked on every 5 minutes but you have to be strong and leave them to get on with it or you may as well keep Lottie in a run on her own. Really, they will get there in the end. Hopefully very soon too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel (& Paul) Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 oh dear. Obviously have lots of food and water stations so that she at least gets the chance of moving to them before pin down. Also getting the other two out of the way is a good idea. I am sure it will get better. We are sending lots of postive thoughts to you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Thanks. Lottie wouldn't walk into eglu so they went in and she searched for food she came to me so before she goes in she's had a lovely bowl of porridge and massive gulps of water from daisies dish . I will now take her back now it's very dark. Tomorrow's another day and sure will be better. BBX Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 19, 2006 Share Posted January 19, 2006 Tucked in safe and sound, heard no objections The forum once again comes into it's own BBx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffie Posted January 20, 2006 Author Share Posted January 20, 2006 Well want to wait until it's about 8am in case of noise so hope all's well in the eglu! update...Lottie could have eaten whilst harrie trotted around eating sweetcorn not bothered one bit but lottie decides to run round shouting and it was quite funny but I understand she thought she was in for it again and wanted me to bring her out. Mikey said he'd want to peck her, the row she was making Anyway Lotties character is starting to come out and she's a princess, mummy's girl I think. She is now sitting head to corner rather than buried into wire and harrie doesn't care nearly as much I think Lottie will realise she has some freedom soon but wants to learn step by step what she can and can't do, which is very sensible. Harrie is being pretty good considering she's going through an ordeal. BBx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 21, 2006 Share Posted January 21, 2006 Update Well Lottie has been pecked and was worried yesterday, her ear quite swollen, I used the night routine of bringing her in for food and water when h and c go to bed to use dilute tea tree and gave her arnica 30c, also gave her aconite 30c for shock. The wound almost healed up this morning and will get the stockholm tar (thanks kate) . Today (day 3) lottie is able to sit facing corner, rather than head pushed into mesh and has more freedom but needs to use it to eat not squawk She did eat in front of harrie at bedtime yesterday I will think twice about doing this again, just to have what I would like, as it's traumatic all round, harrie and Charlie have been given a stressful time too but it's an experience I'm glad to have had. Wish I'd have had 4 from the start but hey ho! BBx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mel (& Paul) Posted January 21, 2006 Share Posted January 21, 2006 oh poor old lottie - but good that she got such loving treatment from you Buffie!! It's so hard isnt it - you have to let them get on with it, but you feel so helpless and also cruel for not intervening. I am sure that with time and your patience things will get much better If not, just get another eglu (Mark III?!?!?!?!) and put lottie and more newbies in that one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffie Posted January 21, 2006 Author Share Posted January 21, 2006 Been difficult today as we have removed the run, now all looks like new and we can see eglu Harrie was going for Lottie as she was trying to be near me in the run and in the end we let the two free range and left lottie to rest . Was able to check Lottie over and she has small wounds on neck and I applied the tar. I really didn't realise she would have to put up with quite so much, almost faultered to be honest. I quite fancy an eglu and bantams and the girls have a new larger eglu. Only problem is will bantams be as difficult as this to introduce? It's not a fair match in size which makes it all the harder for me BBx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chunkin Posted January 21, 2006 Share Posted January 21, 2006 Congratulations on the blue egg Buffie - you've obviously looked after her well I would like more hens too as three eggs a day don't seem to last long with 3 teenagers (and all the associated hangers on who seem to have permanently moved in ). Sounds like a very traumatic process though and I haven't got much space for separating etc. Your 'diary' has been great and really informative - glad you've got the egg as a reward for your hard work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffie Posted January 21, 2006 Author Share Posted January 21, 2006 Thanks carol I really think it's important to understand what the process is like, I have to say I read alot BUT wasn't prepared for how I'd feel about it. There's been many honest postings in this topic so I just want to let you know how it is for me as I go day to day. No one finds it easy of course. Apart from the emotions it does involve some forward thinking and planning and some time too. Update Lottie ran into eglu to escape harrie tonight and then decided to stay put I popped her out the eggport to check over appy more tar and feed. She has now gone back in and tucked herself up with them. They are odd night time truce Perhaps I can do this so we'll see how long the pecking keeps up, it's the actual wounds that have lead to the most difficult feelings today. I laughed when I read someone bought another eglu rather than introduce and now I can see why!! BBx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffie Posted January 22, 2006 Author Share Posted January 22, 2006 update... Well we checked Lottie and neither of us were happy . She could only sit under a feeder all day and is swollen and bald round the neck with a large sore . It was not easy but I decided enough was enough. She is now going to live with fellow bantams and my lovely Harrie and Charlie will equally have a quiet life. Going away soon, it's not going to be ok to worry my parents also. So she's had the wounds tended with tea tree and had a bath as she had to sit in muck, she's grooming and seems calm and fine now:D She is going to get a new house and run and will introduce bantams on return from hol, please tell me this is easier. I had to make a decision as the girls have all had the runs for the 4 days and it's not a happy place, I don't feel I have the right to keep them in an unhappy state so it's done! Hope to get new eglu without run as Mikey wants to create a bantam creation so watch this space. Lottie is sitting on my shoulder as I type so happy girl me thinks! Bx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hillfamily Posted January 22, 2006 Share Posted January 22, 2006 She seems to be a very happy chookie now You have to follow your heart and do what you think is best for your own girls. Sending big hugs to all your girls and thank you for your very honest account - I had been trying to decide whether to intoduce a third girl but really wasn't sure that I had the strength or bravery to even try what I know can ultimately be sucessful. Think if I ever do have anymore chooks, it will be with their own eglu - just not sure I've got a big enough garden - will have to start dreaming of big gardens with room for a sheep or two, a horse, a donkey, a dexter cow (my mum wants one of these) and an eglu in every colour Will wait eagerly to hear details on the Bantam Palace Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mrs Frugal Posted January 22, 2006 Share Posted January 22, 2006 You did your very best, Buffie and your decision is spot on. You know in yourself whether it's right to persevere or not and you obviously knew it wasn't the right thing to do for Lottie. Perhaps her size didn't help but it's always hard to introduce one to an established pair so she'll be fine with hens of her own size. Intervening when a hen is injured or distressed is exactly right and it wouldn't have been fair to give your parents the worry if they hadn't sorted out their pecking order before you went away too. So come on, what colour is the new Eglu going to be ????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffie Posted January 22, 2006 Author Share Posted January 22, 2006 Bless you for your support and this gives another side of the story of intro's. Just checked Lottie in the cat box again and she is snuggled up and sleeping. The plan is green mark 2 (lottie wants pink but mikey not keen) so green it is I never do things in halves Oh well not a failure but another learning curve, I just could not be responsible for the obvious suffering. She even liked having a blow dry so not a needy chook at all Well the end of the intro diary I guess, (until the bantam ladies but Clare or someone please tell me it will be ok) sorry not to have a great success story but the girls always come first rather than me and my ego Size does matter! BBx Will add to this chapter after hols..bantam update awaits! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
