Poorly chicken

[Old Speckled Hen]

Just what I want I'd like to try a poly next to a wooden hive to compare.

http://www.modernbeekeeping.co.uk/

I shall have a look at one at the national Honey show and probably order when they have 14x12 available.

Does anybody else here run poly hives?

[Daphne]

No, but at that price..... Has to be worth a go. Especially as there's lots about polyhives on the other forum

[Guest]

I have a couple of ModernBeekeeping Langstroth jumbo nucleus hives.

 

I have padded them out with styrofoam (encased in fablon) so that my 14 x 12 frames fit.

 

So far I am impressed. They take six frames and need a dummy to prevent an extra comb being added by the bees. The original Lanstroth design was for a 6 frame nuc or two x 3 frame nucs as there is an entrance at each end. (A three frame nuc in poly, with the larger frame size, is easy enough to develop into a larger colony.)

 

The only possible downside I have thought of so far is feeding arrangements for overwintering nuclei, but I am confident that will not present too much of a problem. Five frames and a feeder frame, containing fondant, might be one alternative.

 

The 14 x 12 format will be the one appealing to me; ten frames of the larger format is possibly better than a full 12 squeezed into a wooden jumbo National.

 

Everything seems right for me. Light, durable, warm - and top bee space as well. Goody!

 

Regards, RAB

[Lesley]

Def. worth looking at - let us know what you think after you've seen one?

[beesontoast]

Just what the bees and the planet need - more plastic!

[Lesley]

........and of course, you're using your wooden computer to type on here?

[Guest]

Lesley,

 

Nice one! (re wooden computer).

 

Please don't take this as a snipe at you, but well done even if you only have very little harvest. I hope your bees over-winter well and you get far more next year.

 

You really deserve it by your perseverence. I mean that seriously - you have persisted where others may have thrown in the towel. You have demonstrated your will to succeed and are getting there. I reckon you may well need 150 jars next year, if all goes well - or you may decide to settle for less and increase your colony numbers.

 

I have only kept bees for about ten years, but have had an interest spanning many more. If you want any unbiased straight talking advice please don't be afraid to pm me. I am not really that much of an ogre and if I don't know the answer I probably know of someone who does!

 

Good strong, healthy colonies with adequate pollen and honey stores are the best one can do, going into the winter.

 

I have tended to prefer wooden hives (particularly the Dartingtons over the beehaus), but when the bees are faring better in poly than wood and that poly is proving to have a likely lifespan of over thirty years, all being well, it may be the better option all ways round. I could make, repair and modify my wooden hives far easier than the plastic, but as in several northern european countries polyhives are used/marketed almost to the exclusion of wooden counterparts, they cannot be all bad.

 

There are likely still some poly's on the UK market which may not be up to the standard of durability of the better ones. All I can say, so far, is that the Finnish Paradise Farm ones, the only ones I have even limited experience of, seem to be in the 'good standard' part of the market and I fully intend trying one of the new 14 x 12 polyhives for the coming season.

 

Oh, and well done with your honey competition awards, too.

 

Regards, RAB

WBCs, Std Nationals, Jumbo Nationals, Dartingtons, beehaus - and shortly poly. OMFs and top bee-space universally on all the productive colonies.

[Lesley]

Thanks Rab

 

We were happy to leave the honey for the bees and only take enough for the honey show. We did the same two years ago and won prizes for cakes but not the honey. Our three colonies look very strong going in to winter this time - I have the jars ready!

 

I'm interested in trying a poly hive alongside our Nationals - I hadn't thought about there being different standards...........thanks for mentioning it, I'll be researching them over the winter, over in the other forums.

[beesontoast]

........and of course, you're using your wooden computer to type on here?

 

I don't keep bees in my computer.

 

And when I see bees living in a plastic tree, I will consider using plastic hives.

[Guest]

beesontoast,

 

I would think suitability for purpose might come into it somewhere. Progress? Better use of space? I am sure the bees could not care a jot, but are likely to survive more easily in a thick-walled home in a tree (or a well insulated polyhive) than in a wooden house provide with with just 19mm thick walls as insulation for the cold winter months.

 

Just remember the human race, or their precedents, were cave dwellers at one time. Now we have much more 'suitable' homes (and there are not enough caves around for all). And yes, I know their ancestors lived in trees, but that is now as out-dated as your argument against polyhives. If you had at least kept to the issue of use of fossil fuels in thei manufacture, your argument may have had more credence.

 

Regards, RAB

[Egluntyne]

A polite reminder that ad hominem posts are not encouraged on this forum and some have been removed, to ensure the smooth running of this thread.

 

Cheers.

[beesontoast]

beesontoast,

 

I would think suitability for purpose might come into it somewhere. Progress? Better use of space? I am sure the bees could not care a jot, but are likely to survive more easily in a thick-walled home in a tree (or a well insulated polyhive) than in a wooden house provide with with just 19mm thick walls as insulation for the cold winter months.

 

Fitness for purpose is the point. A tree is absorbent of excess moisture, while plastic is not. Tree play host to myriad moulds, fungi, bacteria and bugs that form the ecosphere in which the bees also live: none of these can thrive on plastic. We know practically nothing about the interactions between these elements and how important they are to the well-being of the bees, so please don't preach about the 'benefits' of plastic unless you have done the research.

 

And BTW, I use 22-25mm timber in my hives.

 

Just remember the human race, or their precedents, were cave dwellers at one time. Now we have much more 'suitable' homes (and there are not enough caves around for all). And yes, I know their ancestors lived in trees, but that is now as out-dated as your argument against polyhives. If you had at least kept to the issue of use of fossil fuels in thei manufacture, your argument may have had more credence.

 

May I remind you that bees have been around for at least 100 million years longer than us, yet they still choose to live in trees. Of course, us clever humans know how to make insecticides and plastics from oil and feed ourselves on genetically engineered crops, which clearly means we should subject bees to the same short-sighted treatment.

 

And since you mention it, what about the use of fossil fuels and their lack of biodegradability?

[Guest]

Fitness for purpose is the point. A tree is absorbent of excess moisture, while plastic is not. Tree play host to myriad moulds, fungi, bacteria and bugs that form the ecosphere in which the bees also live: none of these can thrive on plastic. We know practically nothing about the interactions between these elements and how important they are to the well-being of the bees, so please don't preach about the 'benefits' of plastic unless you have done the research.

 

Very good points,and one's with which i would agree.

Edited November 8, 2010 by Guest

[Old Speckled Hen]

Well, I don't know about the benefits of plastic but the only way I can see if a poly hive will suit my bees is to try one. I have three cedar Nationals and as soon as a 14 x 12 hive is available from Modernbeekeeping I will get one. I have a TBH which my DH made this year and that will be my bait hive next year. I am looking forward to "keeping" all of them.

[Egluntyne]

Please may we keep this dialogue friendly? Thank you.

[Old Speckled Hen]

Def. worth looking at - let us know what you think after you've seen one?

 

I was quite impressed.

I had quite a long chat with John Laidler who sells these hives. They come from Finland and he is just making a few modifications before putting them on sale in the new year.

The 14 x 12 will be two supers and an eke so I don't know if that will be a problem. The boxes fit together with a slight overhang so maybe not. AND soooooooo light.

I will get one to run along side the wooden boxes

[Guest]

OSH,

 

John, said initially it might be a couple of supers and an eke.

 

I suggested they just made an eke, so that any standard box could be converted, but he repied that if demand is sufficient they may well buy the tooling for the single 14 x 12 box.

 

I am on his order list in front of you! I will likely be obtaining some loooong screws to fit the three parts together. That is what I am doing with the floors on my MBS polynucs, I purchased from him. Long, because they will be put in 'on the tosh' so cannot pull apart as easily as if they were screwed in straight (perpendicular to the join).

 

I am impressed with my nucs although they are biiig! Langstroth jumbo size reduced internally for 14 x 12 frames. They will take 6 frames and a dummy board (at present, mine hace 6 frames + an extra wild comb!), or can be slit into two by 3-frame nucs. I am initially using them as 6 framers, but 3 frames on 14 x 12 is an equivalent cell area to a standard 5 frame National nucleus hive anyway. I am just not too keen on one roof over two nucs - But that would be sorted with a sheet of plastic under the roof as 'crown boards', I suppose. I have purchased two more and will probably set up one of those as a 'two x three framer' for next season.

 

'Mechano' angles at the bottom of the divider will keep it in place, even if the end rebates are not propolised in securely!

 

Regards, RAB

[Old Speckled Hen]

OSH,

 

 

 

I am on his order list in front of you! I will likely be obtaining some loooong screws to fit the three parts together.

 

 

Regards, RAB

 

I'm right behind you then

 

Errrrrrr this is probably quite a stupid question but can you screw poly?

[Guest]

The hundred kg per metre cubed stuff is OK. Not flimsy and soft, like the packaging/insulating variety.

 

I would not want to make a heavily stressed structural joint, but simply supporting a floor or the lower half of a brood box is no sweat.

 

As I said, I will put the screws in 'on the tosh'. That will impart much more strength in the joint without relying only on the screw threads gripping the medium.

 

Regards, RAB