The Dogmother Posted September 19, 2012 Share Posted September 19, 2012 This site gives a few facts about raw feeding, but it's far more expensive to buy online than to get from your local butcher... and at least they are local! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superkitty Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Hmm. Lots of food for thought there. So if I go to the butchers and ask for pet mince, will they know what I mean? Or maybe I'll start with the honeys taster pack and see how they go. Sorry to hijack the thread, if I did Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavenders_Blue Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 I don't think all butchers do 'pet mince' (mine don't) but it's worth asking around as you'll probably get the best price from your butcher. If not, I have found Prize Choice minces are okay, although they do work out pricey. I now buy most of my raw meat from a supplier near Melton Mowbray who does chicken carcasses, minces and offal for dogs supplemented with a bit of Prize Choice for variety. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 I'd go and ask the butchers, they don't need much persuading to sell what they'd normally s"Ooops, word censored!". Just ask them to mince up meat off-cuts, offal, heart and light (lungs) and bag it up for you. My butcher freezes it in 1kg bags for me, the bones are also frozen... mainly chicken carcasses (halved) and lamb ribs with the spine end on, I am amazed at how much meat they leave on the chicken carcasses; I don't leave nearly so much when I'm prepping a table bird! The price varies depending on who serves me but as I guide I pay £6-8 for 6 bags of mince and 6 bags of bones; this lasts my two over a week. LBB uses the same butcher and said to me that her working labs and springers have much more energy this season. It's a good source of revenue for them and a kind of recycling, so very eco-friendly as well. The butchers in my town doesn't do any pet stuff, this one is a short drive away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavenders_Blue Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 That's very good, DM! I did go in and ask a few local butchers for s"Ooops, word censored!"s, bones etc but have found them all exceedingly unhelpful particuarly the one who refused to sell me chicken carcasses as I would kill my dog (he wasn't prepared to believe me when I said that raw chicken bones are perfectly safe) I must have unusually unhelpful butchers round here! My raw meat guy sells his meat priced per lb and varies between 35p to 60p per lb depending on what the meat is. I can feed Tango for about 45p a day, so I don't reckon that's too bad - it's about the same as what I'd pay, if not a little less, than for a top-notch kibble and a heck of a lot less than Naturediet which I was feeding previously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dancing cloud Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 I haven't found friendly butchers either Hi Superkitty *waves* ! My spoiled moggies moved from Bozita and Grau tinned food to raw with no problems at all. I initially fed them Durham Animal Foods minces, but couldn't find a supplier here so switched to Honeys, which is delivered by courier within a couple of days of ordering. DAF was cheaper though less finely minced and my lot prefer Honeys. It comes packed in frozen sausages which stack well in the freezer and are easy to use. My four greedy wotsits get through roughly a sausage per day, less on picky days and more on hungry days, though Tozi eats a lot because of his diabetes. I didn't switch gradually, just put the new food in their bowls and let them get on with it, but all of mine are well-fed adults and missing a meal or two wouldn't have hurt . Three of them loved it immediately and Loki picky-paws still won't eat it unless it's "flavoured" with ordinary wet food . No tummy upsets, in fact just the opposite, as tinned food seemed to upset Cleo's tum regularly and she's now fine. Her auto-immune seems to be under better control too and I've been able to greatly reduce the amount of steroids she has to take. Mine seem to be thriving on raw food, just wish it was cheaper ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 There's a lot less 'filler' and processed stuff in raw food, so less likely to upset a dog with a dodgy tum, having said that, some dogs can't tolerate bones/raw meat. My cats love raw pet mince on their biccies of an evening, and one cat will sit on the work surface in the utility room and eat the sardine Fish4Dogs dog kibble straight out of the bag I don't encourage this as cats need differently balanced food with extra Taurine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Interesting article here - lovely photo at the beginning! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatieB Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 I tried raw food recently for my shih tzu and it was a dismal failure I wanted to try it as she inhales food so quickly it cant be good for her. she is currently on Acana which is newish and has no cereal, its 60% meat and 40 veg. It has such good ingredients my friend and I laughed that we should start the diet. Anyway when I tried raw food, I started with chicken necks. Each piece was about the size of a golf ball. She swallowed 2 whole Just think she's quite little. So I went and bought chicken wings. Normal size chicken wings as you would expect. She swallowed a wing whole believe me it took some effort, it was very frightening and I couldnt get to her to stop her. The vet scared me half to death about what could happen and DH banned me from trying again! Maybe I just have to live with gannet dog unless anyone has tips? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 If you're starting on raw food, especially with a 'bolter' then hold onto one end of the piece to get her to slow down; the idea is that they chew it to gain the maximum benefit. Cyrus came to me as a supposedly 'picky eater' he soon took to raw feeding and I handfed him everything at first so that he got the pace right as he had the poundie of bolting his food before anyone else got it. You can also try feeding her a wee bit at a time in her bowl to slow her down. Acana is a very pure (and expensive ) complete food with no fillers or additives so you need to feed less of it. It is excellent if you want to feed dried complete and have the dosh. It's made in Canada so no doubt the shipping costs add to the UK price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatieB Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Re the Acana, although its expensive she is a little dog and you feed so little that a bag seems to last forever. It's also very good as we only get so little from the other end! My husband says I am absolutely not to try raw again. um?? Not sure whether to listen but it does concern me what happened to the chicken wing bone. She hasn't liked her food the same since but doesn't seem ill enough to raise concerns. I did it about 3 or 4 weeks ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 They will digest most small bones and anything else comes out t'other end, raw bones are fine if chewed but avoid cooked bones as they will splinter. If you're going to feed dried complete food then Acana is the best; LBB is a fan of it for when they are travelling and not able to feed raw. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatieB Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 What other bones could I try that would be too big to bolt. What can you feed other than chicken, I'd like to do a mix of raw an Acana Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Try lamb rib bones, my butcher does them with half the spine knuckle on; they are a real favourite. Rabbit is good too. Have you taught her the 'leave it' command? Mine sit and wait until I release them, that slows things down a bit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatieB Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 BTW thanks for all the help. Yes she knows and obeys the leave it command. she did leave it until I released her then she ran for it and swallowed without stopping. It got stuck she heaved I went over and she swallowed again and gone! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted September 20, 2012 Share Posted September 20, 2012 Some dog swill regurgitate bones which they haven't chewed and then re-eat them; it's part of the way they work. Chicken bones are pretty low-density so I wouldn't bother too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatieB Posted September 22, 2012 Share Posted September 22, 2012 I asked in our local butcher today and he is happy to provide as he usually throws bones away, however he said he doesnt have any on saturdays so I'll have to try another day. Another butcher mentioned beef and pork bones, can they be used and are they too big for a shih tzu? Also I was wondering can you give pheasant carcus or parts -plentiful around here as I live in the middle of a bunch of farmers that all go out shooting predominantly pheasant and grouse (I think). I will ask them about rabbit. I have taken another wing out of the freezer and will try it again, by hand, when DH isnt around!!! Thanks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted September 22, 2012 Share Posted September 22, 2012 Pork and beef can be given to dogs but are too big for most TBH, I'd stick with chicken or rabbit with a dog that small. You could try lamb ribs and see how it goes. I usually give whole rabbits, gutted but with their jackets still on, I joint them out and give bits at a time. For some reason mine won't eat pheasant... they are happy enough to give chase and catch them but won't eat it then there's the worm/parasite problem with game, technically you ought to freeze it for a couple of weeks first (to kill of any parasites/parasite eggs) but I reckon that as I gut the bunnies (really easy) first and worm the dogs regularly that they will be fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavenders_Blue Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 Yes to the phessies! Tango loves to catch and eat phessies and it's a good healthy meat. As DM says, beef and pork bones are okay but most are too big. Ribs should be okay but avoid anything weight bearing as they can be too hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatieB Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 I have tried a chicken wing again but DH is making me paranoid. I had to hand give it as when I tried to let go she made it obvious she would swallow it whole again. So she has spent some time licking and pulling from me. Eventually she has started to crunch an end. however I am now being watched by concerned hubby telling me I can take time off work if it goes wrong! I've lost confidence. She has crunched a bit which will come loose, as a gulper though I know if I let her have it she'll swallow not continue to crunch. What sort of size is ok to swallow, baring In mind she is only a small dog. The end is a bit bigger than a knuckle currently. Can sharp bones do damage? Hubby just says why are you trying this she now has raw chicken around her face keep her away from our son! I'm kind of laughing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 Her digestive acids will deal with most chicken bones, which are pretty soft, some come out t'other end. One of my dogs chews better while the other tends to inhale chicken carcasses neither has ever come to any harm, just hold onto the chicken wing or leg until she has the right idea, once she knows that the food is still there and no-one is going to steal it then she will slow down. With regards to dogs and children; I was brought up around raw fed dogs and so was Rosie, we were always taught not to let any dogs lick our faces, and the dogs were trained the same way. There are far worse germs around a dog's gob than those found on raw chicken so it's best not to let them do it in any event. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavenders_Blue Posted September 23, 2012 Share Posted September 23, 2012 Dogs don't chew their food as we do, they tend to crunch through the bones rather than break pieces off to chew. I think as long as it fits down the chute, then it's usually okay (although a whole chicken wing for a Shih Tzu does sound quite large - I'd definitely keep holding on to those!) I don't know how much you feed per day, but could you give her a piece of meat larger than a wing to force her to chew rather than gulp (thigh/drumstick/carcass) or otherwise maybe raw minces with bone already ground in would be safer? I know that doesn't have the same beneficial teeth cleaning effect as chewing bones, but neither does swallowing a whole chicken wing withough crunching! I agree with DM that dogs have plenty more disgusting things lurking around their chops than raw meat. I also don't allow face licking for that very reason! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lillybettybabs Posted September 24, 2012 Share Posted September 24, 2012 For dogs that are new to raw feed and are bolting bones down try giving them a few Nylabones first, It gets them into a habit of chewing rather than bolting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatieB Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Today we are having roast chicken for dinner, so I have cut off the wings myself (before cooking) so that they are quite big. I look at each wing thinking there is no way they could be swallowed whole, so I think I will be brave and we will try again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Good for you. Mine have each had a quarter of raw wild rabbit each, kidneys and all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
