scarlettohara Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 She sounds quite poorly to me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted June 27, 2011 Author Share Posted June 27, 2011 what should I do with her tonight if she doesn't go in the coop? Do I just leave her in the WIR or bring her inside in a box of her own? Or should I put her in the Eglu so she's with the others? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted June 28, 2011 Author Share Posted June 28, 2011 Splash didn't try to make it into the coop last night so I took her inside, made her comfy in a box, gave her treated water and slept on the sofa next to her in case I heard anything. I did - 3am - looked in and she was on her side and I saw her take her last breath Few follow on questions.................. My bins are not due for collection for another 2 weeks (!) - can I bag/freeze her until then? Is there anything I should now do - not knowing for certain what the problem was? I'll be keeing the other 3 on treated water for the next week - as per bottle instructions! Silkies were my 1st choice of chicken, so it's doubly disappointing to lose my 1st one only 3 days in. Given the other 3 are still under 9wk old, would I be ok introducing another ONE or would TWO be better? Thanks for all the advice and help yesterday - what a HORRID intro to chicken keeping! She was the biggest and greediest of them all - at least she showed them the way to eat from my hand! RIP Splash x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scarlettohara Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 I'm sorry not a nice way to start with chooks Don't get another silkie, they are not an easy breed to keep especially with others and not when they are the only silkie. I thought long and hard before I got mine and only went ahead when I found a reputable breeder who vaccinates against Mareks, I rehomed 2 more last week (18 months old) but from someone I knew who had had them since chicks (however they have been quarantined). My silkies live separately to the others when not fring. There are lots of breeds of bantams that are easy to keep - ie wyandottes, but you need to wait until you know your existing girls are free of cocci etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jools Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 I'd agree - see how the three you have get on for a while before making any changes. Sorry to hear about your Silkie, it's a horrible start for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egluntyne Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 That is such a shame. I would contact the breeder immediately, as s/he needs to know that there is illness in the flock for the avoidance of spreading it to other unsuspecting purchasers. S/he should also be offering you your money back, although I realise that this would be of little compensation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted June 28, 2011 Author Share Posted June 28, 2011 I will be contacting her a bit later (after the school run) When will I know for certain that the other 3 are clear of anything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chucky Mama Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 I'd get a sample off for analysis without too much delay. If it is cocci it will confirm this. Of course take samples ASAP as you are treating them now and it will affect the results. Keep stress to a minimum so as little handling and changes in diet and temperature as possible. Whilst it is tempting to give treats and interact it does add to their stress. Definitely get in touch with the breeder. They are not about to admit that they may has cocci or that the chick was poorly when it left them but healthy chicks don't get sick and die Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daphne Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Sorry to hear that Without knowing exactly what Splash had its hard to know for certain when the others will be OK. I would keep monitoring them and at the first sign of either blood or hunched lethargy with closed eyes then either get the coxoid out or go to the vet. Personally I probably wouldn't get another grower just yet as you don't know whats going on ATM and growers haven't developed resistance to some things as older birds do so there is a danger that you might expose any new stock to cocci or whatever it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted June 28, 2011 Author Share Posted June 28, 2011 There is, potentially, a bit of good news here. Spoken with breeder - they VACCINATE against cocci as well as feed the medicated food so it really shouldn't be that and/or the others shouldn't have it. Obviously, it may have been that it hadn't built up it's immune system like others do, but she's also said it could be other things - something it's eaten/cold/stress - etc etc She's very suprised and shocked at what happened but has offered to burn it for me and refund/replace x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chucky Mama Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Would your breeder pay for a PM? We must be careful that we are not focussing entirely on cocci without actually having any clear evidence which is why I suggest sending a sample off or a pm. It could be an issue with this bird only. I would not bring in any new chicks at this point. You need to know what is going on and need to be sure that the birds that you have got are healthy (and birds that you may be bringing in for that matter). It is tough introduction to poultry keeping starting with young stock like this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jools Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 What growers pellets do you have them on? You can get medicated growers (with ACS like chick crumb) which is preferable to coxoid in youngsters - but you cannot use both. If you breeder feeds medicated chick crumb, they may well feed medicated growers as a further precaution against cocci. I agree that blood in droppings doesn't automatically mean cocci, just as no blood in watery droppings doesn't mean it's not cocci. It's easy to jump to conclusions and head down the wrong route. In your shoes, I'd hunker down, keep the remaining three chicks as healthy and stress-free as possible before making any further plans. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted June 28, 2011 Author Share Posted June 28, 2011 thanks for the advice - I've got them on Farmholders growers. No signs of anything with the other 3 Does anyone know when I could probably given the 'all clear' ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwing Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 If they 'vaccinate' against cocci (and by this I assume they use Baycox) then they shouldnt feed medicated food too and you shouldnt be feeding it now (the bag will say 'rearer Pellets ACS' if its medicated) A breeder should use an either/or approach or not treat at all, double treatment cancels out any benefits They dont sound very knowledgable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jools Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 If they 'vaccinate' against cocci (and by this I assume they use Baycox) then they shouldnt feed medicated food too and you shouldnt be feeding it now (the bag will say 'rearer Pellets ACS' if its medicated) A breeder should use an either/or approach or not treat at all, double treatment cancels out any benefits They dont sound very knowledgable Isn't the vaccine Paracox? I thought Baycox was the vet prescribed (and best) treatment for cocci? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chucky Mama Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 Baycox is "For the treatment of coccidiosis in Broilers and Broiler Breeders. Baycox 2.5% Solution is effective against Eimeria acervulina, E. brunetti, E. maxima, E. necatrix, E. tenella, E. mitis."(overusage results in resistant strains) Paracox is "For the active immunisation of chickens to reduce infection and clinical signs of coccidiosis caused by Eimeria acervulina, E. maxima, E. mitis and E. tenella. Immunity begins to develop within 14 days post vaccination and is maintained for at least 40 days post vaccination." It comes in a minimum quantity of a 1,000 dose pack which needs to be kept refrigerated. I would be pretty useless if out of date or stored at room temperature. I would ask your breeder to tell you specifically what they have used. If they are truly 'dealing' with cocci in their stock they will know the name of what they are using and how without any prompting. I have no idea who they are, maybe someone on the forum knows them, but I am sceptical about their claims. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwing Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 If they 'vaccinate' against cocci (and by this I assume they use Baycox) then they shouldnt feed medicated food too and you shouldnt be feeding it now (the bag will say 'rearer Pellets ACS' if its medicated) A breeder should use an either/or approach or not treat at all, double treatment cancels out any benefits They dont sound very knowledgable Isn't the vaccine Paracox? I thought Baycox was the vet prescribed (and best) treatment for cocci? Sorry I did mean Paracox, teach me to multitask whilst typing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted June 28, 2011 Author Share Posted June 28, 2011 They've been keeping/breeding/showing for years so I don't doubt them for a minute - she did tell me what it was but I've forgotten - and that they DO do everything they need to re vaccination/feeds etc etc correctly. They haven't had anyone have a bird from them before that's had a problem - guess they have now (although we don't know for certain that it's cocci) I had a similar experience on another animal forum where all hell broke loose with people rounding up on a particular breeder saying they should kill off the rest of their stock because it was 'assumed' that 1 animal had something that was drastic/contagious. In the end, a specialist vet gave them the facts (that other animals would be safe) and basically 'saved' the other animals from death! I obviously bow to people on here that have kept chickens for a long time (and I'm a complete novice), without an instant sample analysis, there's not going to be any way of proving one way or the other what Splash had. She may have ingested something sharp/harmful which led to her sad demise etc but I don't doubt for one minute that my supplier knows her stuff Thanks for all the support x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwing Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 With respect you asked for advice and people took the trouble to reply How much of that you choose to believe or follow is of course up to you, no one was diagnosing the problem 100% - just offering advice on what they thought the problem was based on their own experiences and the symptoms, your details on what the breeder does and does not do are differing between posts which doesnt help people! I stand by my comment that if the breeder vaccinates AND feeds medicated feed (as you said they did) then they are doing things wrong, its a basic thing that a reputable breeder wouldnt get wrong, I only offered this comment because of what you said: 'Spoken with breeder - they VACCINATE against cocci as well as feed the medicated food' If you want the facts from a specialist vet then take a sick bird to a vet instead of asking on a forum! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted June 28, 2011 Author Share Posted June 28, 2011 sorry if I've caused offence in someway - certainly didn't mean to It's been a very confusing and upsetting time and I've no doubt any inaccuracies on my part won't have helped people advise further. All I can say is that I trust that the breeder knows her stuff and that, for whatever reason, something happened to Splash I was going to the vet today (had it survived) but sadly had to cancel the appointment I am extremely grateful for all the help and advice received - just gutted that the little thing didn't make it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chucky Mama Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 It is great that you have a breeder that is so knowledgeable and that you trust. Perhaps they could make themselves more accessible to you in times of crisis. Good luck with your remaining chicks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted June 28, 2011 Author Share Posted June 28, 2011 Spoken with breeder - they VACCINATE against cocci as well as feed the medicated food so it really shouldn't be that and/or the others shouldn't have it There was a bit of confusion earlier, so I really wanted to apologise for the misunderstanding the above post caused I've met with breeder - she does NOT use medicated food after vaccinating and has confirmed she's not had anyone else have any get sick/die on them before so is still of the opinion that little Splash didn't have cocci. However, I'm keeping the others on the mediated water for a week before thinking of getting any replacement/s Thanks again for your help.............hope it's a LONG time before I need it again!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jools Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 Just wondering how you're getting on Witzend? How are the three chicks and are you still sleeping with them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witzend Posted July 5, 2011 Author Share Posted July 5, 2011 Thanks for asking - yes all is fine. I only slept next to the one that was 'off' - I'd brought it into the house in a box to make it comfy. Breeder is letting me have another without charge..........will update when I have it/them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfer_chicken Posted July 5, 2011 Share Posted July 5, 2011 And more pictures of course! I'm glad it wasn't a complete disaster, but still sorry you had such an unlucky start to chicken keeping x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
