Chicken bald back

[SueChick]

UPDATE - all sorted please see last post on this thread)

 

I have been fighting an ongoing battle with one bald chicken - things tried:

 

Bullying (not that as others have bits on now)

Red mite/lice (sprayed and dusted to death!)

Allergic reaction to bedding (changed type)

Boredom (lots of enrichment)

Nutritional deficiency (poultry spice, limestone flour, moulting solution in water)

Natural moult (going on way too long as very sore bald patches)

 

I am now left with conclusion of depluming mite. I have been using Johnsons Anti-mite spray but I understand this doesn't work very well so I have ordered some Flower of Sulpur powder as per people's advice and I'm going to mix it with E45 and paint the sore bits with it.

 

I will let you how I get on - after reading lots of posts I think this is a more common problem than people think. We always hear about red mite/lice/northern fowl mite but not about depluming mite.

 

I will keep you posted.

Edited April 9, 2012 by Guest

[Plum]

What a nightmare. Not had experience (madly touching wood) but will be interested to hear how you get on and if she responds.

[The Dogmother]

Don't forget to add a tonic and/or some Biotin to their diet to help the new feathers grow.

[sparkysmum]

Hope you don't mind me asking but have you sought a vets advice. Well worth the consultation fee, I think esp if you're not 100% sure whats going on. I think they're best placed to advise & supply appropriate meds if need be. Hope you get to the bottom of whatever is going on. Alli x

[SueChick]

Thanks for your replies - yes I have talked to a good vet but haven't seen one yet. She suggested red mite but I've tried that.

 

I have just smeared on E45 with sulphur so I'm going to give this a go before I try the vet again.

 

Does anyone know how often I need to do this? And how long it was before people saw a difference?

 

Fingers crossed.

[bevmatt]

Also have you tried a worming treatment? If she has internal parasites it may be driving her mad - just a thought?

[SueChick]

Yes have tried worming - all normal bases covered I think!

 

One application of sulphur has definitely brought down the redness but they are still over preening and shaking wings a lot like they are itchy but going to keep applying as they are less sore at least.

[SueChick]

Can someone tell me how often to apply the sulfer and E45? I mixed 1 dessert full of E45 and half teaspoon of sulphur and painted them and there is a good response on redness. When should I do it again?

[Egluntyne]

I used flowers of sulphur mixed with sudocreme (purely as a medium with which to apply it) a few years ago. I think I did it every day for a week and then reduced it to alternate days, then a couple of times a week. It did the trick.

[SueChick]

Thanks for the reply. Do you know if there is an egg withdrawal period at all with sulphur?

[The Dogmother]

I very much doubt it.

 

There's a Sulphur and Rosemary Cream here which might prove useful.

[SueChick]

Thought I'd let you know where we currently are with baldness saga. Flowers of sulphur in sudocream worked a little bit (redness went down and a few little feathers appeared but didn't really have amazing results like other people have). By the way, apparently E45 is not a good idea as the vit D in it can affect the calcium/phosphorous metabolism (vet said and advised sudocream to soothe skin - he also said sulphur was an old wives tale but I'm still not sure as lots if people on here have sworn by it).

 

Anyway, up until Friday night I was happy to let the sulphur slowly work because there was a little improvement and the chooks were not distressed by the baldness or the creaming up routine. However on Friday they seemed to take a turn for the worse and started to show signs of illness for the first time (up until then they were very happy and chirpy). They had the head pulled in lethargic stance of ill chickens and so I panicked and took them to the vets the next day. Very pleased with the Pets at Home pets if all places very reasonably priced and thorough and knowledgeable. He took a skin sample and feather sample and looked under the microscope - imagine my surprise when he found lice!!!

 

Considering the fact that I've been squirting with Johnson anti mite spray, powdering with louse powder and red mite barrier, I couldn't believe my ears. Especially as I've examined them to death poor things and there was no sign of lice or eggs!!! Vet said you only see them if they ate heavily affected but that they probably have depluming mited as well.

 

 

He has given me Ivermectin Eprinex to put 5 drops on neck and withdrawal eggs for 7 days. I did this late last night and the change in the girls is amazing already! Redness is down a lot and more importantly chooks look bright eyed and bushy tailed already and it's not even 24 hours after meds yet! When I said some people say depluming mite is resistant to Ivermectin - he said it depends on the dose and how it's administered. So fingers crossed!

 

I really don't want to speak to soon but I'm very hopeful....

[The Dogmother]

Sounds as if they were heavily affected then. He certainly knows his stuff.

 

I always use Ivomec Eprinex* on my birds, dosing quarterly as a preventative. Can I recommend that you clean the housing with Total Mite Kill Concentrate and powder with Buz Busters? This will get rid of any critters lurking in the coop/eglu.

 

*not licensed for use on poultry in the UK

[SueChick]

Thx for the reply - I have been spraying all the Eglu cracks and bars with total mite spray 1/2 per week and only found a few red mite on the first spray and none since. However I understand that if it's a lice and not mite problem they will be on the bird not the coop - is this right?

 

Do you use anything else on the birds or just Eprinex - does it work well?

[The Dogmother]

You will find the odd louse in the housing, so it's best to spray that too.

 

I've used Ivomec Eprinex* for years and it works really well, even on northern fowl mites which are hard to get rid of. If I see the odd louse on the birds then I spray them with a permethrin based spray; usually the red aerosol by Nettex*.

 

* not licensed for use on poultry in the UK

[SueChick]

The saga continues and I don't know how much more fight I have left in me.....

 

Big initial response to Eprinex lasted 6 days and today her skin looked a little redder again (had gone down to pink only) and a bit more feather ruffling was spotted by this evening she had attacked her own base of tail feathers again and broken off new quills and taken them down to blood again! Stress is not the word for how I'm feeling with it all now.

 

What happened? Why did the Eprinex stop working? Should I use the Johnson's anti-mite spray at the same time? If so, how often and how much? Do I spray on the site bare patches or under the wings where there are some feathers?

 

I'm going to see the vets again for another skin and feather sample but I STILL haven't found any crawlies in the Eglu or on the birds!

 

Anyone out there with some ideas? I don't know about pulling feathers but I feel like pulling my hair out!!!

[The Dogmother]

The Eprines should only be used once a month, spray any visible lice with 2 treatments a week apart.

 

I wonder if she's got into a habit through stress... have you tried some anti-peck spray?

[SueChick]

Thx again for your help. The trouble is thative never seen even one louse (the vet saw them under the microscope). He said they were just under the skin.

 

I have sprayed with purple spray and anti peck tonight because I wondered if she's just itchy now due to the skin damage (like a child scratching at a healing scab). So we will see I'd that helps.

 

Did you mean spray Johnsons spray 1 week apart? How many sprays do you use?

 

Running out of ideas/options now!

[superkitty]

What about a bath in dog shampoo? When I was struggling with NFM, a good soak in a warm bath with dog shampoo (with permethrin in) seemed to really help knock down the lice numbers enough for the Ivomec eprinex to work. It took a few goes though, a week apart. I did finally got on top of them but it did take quite a long time (more than a month ) lots of baths, lots of johnsons anti-mite and two applications of the Ivomec eprinex (plus me NUKING the eglu every 5 days) to get shot of them.

 

Chin up, you have my utmost sympathy, it's really hard to keep trying and it seems nothing works isn't it? You will get there in the end.

[SueChick]

Thx for your help - I haven't tried bathing yet - was hoping not to have to due to cold weather but might need to I think.

 

Does the Eprinex not get washed off though or is it on the blood stream now?

 

Do you need to withdraw eggs with the dog shampoo? I withdraw for 48 hours as per Johnsons advice when I spray with their pyrethrum anti-mite spray.

 

Sorry for all the questions!

[superkitty]

I'm still a novice (only got the girls in September and got hit with the NFM in November ) so I don't actually know. Because neither the shampoo or the Ivomec eprinex are licensed for poultry there aren't any guidelines..and when I was struggling, the girls hadnt even started laying yet So there was no egg withdrawal issue I did get advised to wait a month between Ivomec applications, so while I was waiting to be able to do it again, I bathed them and used the johnsons. The second time was definitely the charm(worth the FORTUNE that the Ivomec cost!!), but I think the baths really helped. I got a ton of really useful advice while I was flailing around in a panic, including on the best way to bath them. I don't know how to link to a thread, but the URL for the thread is below. Hope it helps, and good luck!

 

http://club.omlet.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=84853

[The Dogmother]

What about a bath in dog shampoo? When I was struggling with NFM, a good soak in a warm bath with dog shampoo (with permethrin in) seemed to really help knock down the lice numbers enough for the Ivomec eprinex to work. It took a few goes though, a week apart. I did finally got on top of them but it did take quite a long time (more than a month ) lots of baths, lots of johnsons anti-mite and two applications of the Ivomec eprinex (plus me NUKING the eglu every 5 days) to get shot of them.

 

Chin up, you have my utmost sympathy, it's really hard to keep trying and it seems nothing works isn't it? You will get there in the end.

 

I remember that you had a real struggle.

 

TBH I've never heard of lice underneath the skin, but give the ivomec eprinex a week to sink in before bathing - just as you do with the dog preps. If you are spraying, then do it twice, a week apart but you shouldn't spray if you are bathing them.

[SueChick]

Thanks again - so glad you're here to help.

 

I thought one week after Eprinex before bathing because of egg withdrawal period but wasn't completely sure.

 

I gave them a good spray this morning with Johnsons and then I'll do them again next Monday.

 

I usually withdraw the eggs for 48 hrs but I think 72 this time as a gave them a few more squirts than usual.

 

You said you use Eprinex quarterly and then spray any lice you see - do you leave a week after Eprinex before you use the Johnsons? And when you spray how long do you withdraw eggs for?

 

So I wouldn't bath them and then spray afterwards? Is that too much pyrethium? If so, how long after bathing should I spray them?

 

Sorry again for the masses if questions but it's so nice to have someone experienced to call upon!

[The Dogmother]

I tend to spray when I do the Eprinex but only if I see the odd bug, it's rare but I'm too lazy and forgetful to remember to leave a week before spraying... with 13 hens it just won't get done

 

You shouldn't need to spray after bathing unless the infestation is very bad - they are getting the permethrin/pyrethrum from bathing and it'd be too much.

[SueChick]

Thank you so much for your quick reply - you've been so helpful!

 

When/if you spray out of Eprinex egg withdrawal period do you withdraw for Johnsons? If so, how long?

Hopefully this will be the last question!!!