bunee1 Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 Right then you clever lot......Division by"Chunking" For example 48/3= 48 -30 (think of the highest number you know that 3 goes into) ------ (10 multiplied by 3) 18 - 18 (How many 3's in 18 ) ------- (6 multiplied by 3) 00 (now take that "chunk" of 18 away from 18 ) We now have 10 lots of 3 (30) and 6 lots of 3 (18 ) so we have 16 lots altogether.... 48/3 = 16 This was the example given sorry about the sum it won't pan out quite right!! This was my 8yr olds homework that is meant to take her between 20 and 30 mins ! (the method alone takes hours to write out) I know this has been said time and time again but what's wrong with the old method?, she can do it that way in seconds. Crumbs i can't wait for secondary school P.s It's good to be back how are you all? I'm tired and starting to look pregnant ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lesley-Jean Posted November 22, 2006 Share Posted November 22, 2006 Right then you clever lot......Division by"Chunking" For example 48/3= 48 -30 (think of the highest number you know that 3 goes into) ------ (10 multiplied by 3) 18 - 18 (How many 3's in 18 ) ------- (6 multiplied by 3) 00 (now take that "chunk" of 18 away from 18 ) We now have 10 lots of 3 (30) and 6 lots of 3 (18 ) so we have 16 lots altogether.... 48/3 = 16 WHAT ARE THEY MAD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louise Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Maths at a sensible hour is bad enough I wish I hadn't opened this subject Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egluntyne Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 eh??????????? Can make neither head nor tail of this method. The old fashioned way was dead easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnnieP Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Oh dear, here I go, wading in and rolling my sleeves up for a fight.... This way is taught to young childrren so that they can understand what division actually is. ie a process of organising a set of numbers into "lots". It is a natural progression from actually using the cubes and splitting them into the correct groups which che would have done previouly. I agree, it is not an efficient method, and she will soon move on to the way we were all taught, but from my experience, this way allows children to really understand how division works, and when they understand it, it kind of helps doesn't it? I was taught formal methods with no explaination other than "it works, just do it". You wouldn't expect your child to read a book written in Russian, why expect them to just do mathematical methods which make no sense to their understanding? It is a brilliant progression. Trust me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egluntyne Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 If you say so. You've no idea what a relief it is to no longer have a child at this stage of their education!!. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lesley Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Well, it makes a bit more sense when you explain it Annie - perhaps teachers would find that parents would be more helpful if it were explained to them as well? Nice to see you around Bunnee Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theherd123 Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Well done Annie - glad you braved this one! I looked and thought - No Thanks, not today! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunee1 Posted November 23, 2006 Author Share Posted November 23, 2006 Pheeew i have biiig old bags under my eyes this morning after last nights division terrors ..... Thankyou for explaining Annie i do now see the logic behind this mad method which nearly reduced me and my daughter to tears. As Lesley said it would be much easier if this was pre explained to parents before planting it on our children only to explode when they get home. I thought all the school stuff was behind me but it appears i have to re learn it in a totally different way aaaahhhghghghghgh Watch this space Annie i may be asking more questions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicola H Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Bunee i can sympathise with you I had the same thing with my daughter last year she was in tears because she couldn't understand it and I couldn't help because it didn't make sense to me either in the end I had to pay a tutor to sit with her for 2 hours and explain it.........She was so upset by it all, her teacher at school just lost her temper with Emily and that made things worse I asked what I could do to help and she told me not to interfere the school would sort it out ...But they obviously didn't. Emily is now in year 5 and has moved on to using the more traditional method of division and is doing fine, her new teacher is more approachable and helpful which has made all the difference. Good luck you will get there......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aunty e Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 That's how I do division. I have problems with numbers and the only way I get round it is to have memorised the times tables and the pairs of numbers that can make up ten (3 and 7, 8 and 2 and so on) and then work from that. This method is exactly how I do division. I can't do it any other way. Except with a calculator! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 We now have 10 lots of 3 (30) and 6 lots of 3 (18 ) so we have 16 lots altogether.... 48/3 = 16 WHAT ARE THEY MAD this is how my kids are/were taught - personally I think it makes a lot of sense. It is (basically) the old method - but if you try to write out any "method" it sounds more complicated than it is. This method teaches the mechanics of division - what does it actually "mean" to divide something? Alongside this there is quite a good stress nowadays on mental maths - how you might work something out without access to a calculator. some of it - to my initial horror - is about making a good guess rather than about getting the "right" (as in exact to 3 decimal points!) answer. I was initially disturbed by this - but having thought about it - guesstimate maths is probably the thing we do most often (when shopping in France and wanting to know if it is a reasonable price or not - you "guess" the currency conversion rather than make an exact calculation... and your "guess" is not a stab in the dark - but an approximation based on sound mathematical principles...) I did a maths degree many moons ago - I like to get the exact answer provable 20 different ways - but those skills are not the ones I use most often! Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 I must admit we have had the same problems with Harry and Jules homework They have both brought home things that I could not understand so I couldn't help them. One particular piece resorted to me trawling the internet to find an explanation I could understand and then try and help Jules understand it I could do it the traditional way but not the new way We did get there in the end and it was right (phew) Perhaps parents could be given a few explanatory notes to help them to help their children Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Perhaps parents could be given a few explanatory notes to help them to help their children I think it would be fantastic if schools found a way to introduce parents to some of the changes that have taken place in learning-techniques (I think it's particularly pointed in maths..) but, of course, teachers are already overworked. If a way could be found then it would be a great step towards what all schools proclaim that they want - greater parental involvement in the children's education.. Phil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karen & co. Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Perhaps parents could be given a few explanatory notes to help them to help their children I think it would be fantastic if schools found a way to introduce parents to some of the changes that have taken place in learning-techniques (I think it's particularly pointed in maths..) but, of course, teachers are already overworked. If a way could be found then it would be a great step towards what all schools proclaim that they want - greater parental involvement in the children's education.. Phil I have to put my hand up here and say we had a How Children Learn evening at school this week . Parents were invited in to be shown how the children are being taught, and given a few examples to work out themselves They have done it a couple of times now as obviously parents change as new ones come into the school, and it is always really well attended karen x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lesley-Jean Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 Perhaps parents could be given a few explanatory notes to help them to help their children I think it would be fantastic if schools found a way to introduce parents to some of the changes that have taken place in learning-techniques (I think it's particularly pointed in maths..) but, of course, teachers are already overworked. If a way could be found then it would be a great step towards what all schools proclaim that they want - greater parental involvement in the children's education.. Phil Parents evening was always a big "show" at the school I worked at, hours spent on displays, teachers standing around for ages just incase a parent wanted to ask a question. How about including a few workshops that interested parents could attend Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 That sounds a brilliant idea Karen I have found now that if Dan or myself can't help Jules with her maths then Harry is a very good teacher He did struggle with maths for a while but he really has got the hang of it now and just flys through any homework he has without much help from us He has had some very, very good teachers who have always been approachable and helpful and I think this has helped tremendously Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ubereglu Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 I did it that way!!! I don't now though. Short division's so much quicker!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnnieP Posted November 23, 2006 Share Posted November 23, 2006 We run a monthly "drop in" for parents where they can just pop in to one of our teachers (who gets paid extra) after school so they can find out or ask stuff like this. We also have maths workshops every term where we show parents what will be coming up for their child. It makes a huge difference if parents know why their children are being taught these "odd" methods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bunee1 Posted November 23, 2006 Author Share Posted November 23, 2006 We finished THE homework tonight and we nearly enjoyed it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnnieP Posted November 24, 2006 Share Posted November 24, 2006 easy there! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cate in NZ Posted November 24, 2006 Share Posted November 24, 2006 Maths Been away for a few days, so doing a very rapid forum round up...... obviously not being discriminating enough with my threads. If I'd realised this was maths I'd have avoided it That said, I never did get my head around the modern methods of teaching maths, fortunately hubby did , and he was able to help both the children at that stage. It does seem to have paid off for them though, they do actually seem to understand the workings of maths and to be a lot more confident with their maths than I ever was. So there must be something in it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
