Poorly chicken

[libby22]

Hi

 

Two year old Pepper has been off to the vets this morning, as late last night she started to drip blood from her vent. This morning she was up and about, ate a little and had a drink, then more blood started to drip and she took herself into a corner to stand quietly. I bathed her in warm water, which she seemed to enjoy as she promptly fell asleep, then got her off to the vet.

 

I explained that I thought an egg had broken inside her, even though she has only been laying soft membrane eggs for 2 months now. They were very thorough and took her off to be weighed and to get a second opinion from the head vet. When she came back, she was shooting quite a lot of water from her vent, so I gathered they had flushed her out a little as she was covered in poo and blood again when we arrived.

 

The diagnosis was an infection and Baytril was prescribed. In addition, they asked me to increase her calcium intake for 10 days before bringing her back. I already give her oyster shell, spinach, yoghurt and kale so am not sure what else can help. The Baytril was to be administered via a syringe once a day straight into her beak.

 

On the way home, she laid a crunched up egg shell, which must have hurt so much as it was like glass. Following that was a soft membrane egg and following that was a lot of very stinky poo. The flush out seemed to have really helped.

 

I have been reading up on Baytril and most of the posts I have found mention that it is added to the drinking water. Could anyone tell me if there are different types of Baytril? This one is labelled Baytril 2.5% oral solution - give 1 ml once a day for ten days.

 

I wonder if this is just so the other girls don't end up drinking the medication as well - if it is given to her directly that is? The last vets I went to with one of my girls charged me £120 for antibiotic tablets and metacam and the tablets were the size of a 10 pence piece so they went everywhere other than in the chicken by the end of the week. They then tried to talk me into a £140 x-ray to see if there were any eggs stuck, when she was simply off colour in the end due to a softie. Being new to chickens at the time, I had no idea about softies. Therefore, I am glad to have found this vet and get the liquid form antibiotic. Two visits plus medication came to only £27.40. I just wondered if I could administer it via food etc, as she starts to feel better, she is going to be difficult to catch and medicate.

[Daphne]

Direct application via a syringe into the beak is a good way of getting a lot of meds into a sick bird quickly. You can get soluble meds which go in the water, but as everybody can have a go at that the dosage is a lot lower. Just for info, for very ill birds, injection direct into the breast/bloodstream is the best thing to do. Is there somebody who could hold the bird whilst you administer the dose? If not, try wrapping her in a towel to stop wing flappage. I'm not sure about putting it on food, I wonder if it would slow down the absorption

 

I'm sorry you had an expensive vet who perhaps was looking for a fast buck but I'm very glad you've found one with a much better menu of prices and by the sounds of it, thorough treatment

[libby22]

Hi

 

Thanks for coming back to me. I think I will try the towel route - definitely need some wing control

 

After a very rocky start today, she is now diving about the pen and jumping off the climbing frame I shall keep an eye on her, but I think at the moment, it must be such a relief that everything has moved on and hopefully the pain has stopped. I will do as you suggest though and keep the medication going via syringe.

 

I used to worry so much that I didn't have vet back up, so am really over the moon now, especially as it is one of the vets attached to the large pet centres so is only about 15 mins away.

[Plum]

Same as Daphne and you can get liquid calcium and give 1 ml on a small piece of bread, can't remember what it's called so will get back to you after a search. You can add limestone flour to food but then they all get it and can mess the others up.

[Plum]

It's Zolcal D you can find it at prt shops or online and only costs a few quid. Just use for a while not all the time

 

Good that she's responding

[libby22]

Thanks so much. Straight onto the internet to order as we speak. Hopefully it will do the trick.

[libby22]

Pepper seems a lot brighter and is eating well. She hasn't passed any soft eggs, or any type of eggs so glad her system is getting a rest. However, she does seem to have an upset tum and I wondered if this may be the medication? Tonight I am going to have to wash her back end as she is extremely messy. I have never had any of them as bad as she looks now.

 

Has anyone had a similar experience? I am not sure if she is still store from the cuts perhaps?

[Plum]

They do pass a lot of urates for a while after an infection which is like white powdery deposit on tail feathers. It's probably worth getting her checked in case she needs a longer course of antibiotics

[libby22]

Thanks Plum. I have an appointment ready booked for Sunday afternoon to see how she is getting on, so may bring that forward if needs be. She is eating and drinking well, preening and digging and running around the pen. I have sat outside watching her to see if she is passing normal droppings (what a job!) and she is - normal size, consistency etc.

 

She still has four doses of Baytril left to take. However, I bathed her gently this evening. I added a few inches of water to the bath and sat her, in the cat carrier in the bath. The water gently slopped into the basket and she floated along having a drink here and there! Next step was a few mealworms in a dish floated in front of her so that I can soap her back end. I bought a baby sponge, in case she was sore, but there was no redness when I cleaned her up. However, there was a white patch with a slighter darker patch next to it, both about the size of a 5 pence piece and they were not going to budge without me hurting her. They are not on her vent, but about half an inch further down.

 

Whilst following a few more mealworms, she sat on the edge of the bath and let me dry her a little. She then went back into her run, once she had a quick squirt of purple spray on her rear end.

 

I had noticed a little bit of a smell around her which was unusual and having googled, I wonder if she has the start of Vent Gleet, which I see can be triggered by antibiotics? It said to treat by feeding her live yoghurt, which I had already done yesterday and today - always do if they are off colour. She has had yoghurt with Bokashi bran and Avipro powder to give her a big pro and prebiotic hit. She also has ACV in her water already.

 

I have just added Stalosan powder to their run and raked it in, changed the bedding she has been sleeping on just in case, put out fresh water with ACV and have some live yoghurt on standby for the morning, but I am not sure what else to do. The poor thing can't seem to win at the moment.

[Plum]

She couldn't have better care

 

Just go easy on giving other things until antibiotics finished in case they interact but vet will tell you.

[The Dogmother]

You are doing brilliantly just keep it up and remain vigilant. Do keep us informed of her progress.

[libby22]

Thank you both. I was up early to check on her and she was full of beans and tucking into her breakfast. She wasn't very messy at the back - that slight yeasty smell is still there, as are the two sore points. Gave her another small amount of purple spray and I will clean her again this evening. I feel I would like to put something on the sores - just not sure what.

[The Dogmother]

Do you have a photo of the sore points? I wonder if they are pressure sores on her pelvic bones

 

I would use Sudocrem on any sore areas to protect the skin.

 

I've used injectable Baytril before and it works very quickly.

[libby22]

Hi. I don't have a photo at the moment unfortunately - I have just washed, dried her and put her to bed. She was very messy by the time she went up to have a bath and the yeasty smell is still there. When she was washed and dried, she hopped up on the shelf, so I managed to get a good look at her back end. Just below her vent, there is a rough patch which is and 1 inch by 1/2 an inch. It is discoloured. Initially it looks like dried on urates, but if that is the case, it is really stuck tight to her skin, to form a stiff rough patch. But I am more worried that it is a yeast infection and this is a sore.

 

I didn't use any soap this time, just tepid water and I did put a dab of sudocrem on the sore much to her annoyance, simply because I couldn't think what else to use! Within minutes of her being put back in her pen, she was dripping white fluid from her behind again.

 

I have phoned the vet and managed to get an appointment for Friday afternoon which is the earliest they could see me so fingers crossed she is ok until then. Thank you everyone for your help and suggestions, it has helped so much to be able to talk this over with people who will understand. Unfortunately, I am still leaning toward Vent Gleet, triggered by the stress of the eggs being stuck and the vet visit and then the antibiotics killing all the beneficial bacteria in her system.

[The Dogmother]

If you suspect a yeast infection, then add a little ACV to the water when you bathe her.

[libby22]

That is a really good idea. I am going to bathe her again tomorrow evening to try to keep her from getting sore so I will do that. Thank you. I didn't want to use salt as she sometimes drinks the water, but at least this way, it won't hurt her.

 

Thanks again.

[Redwing]

To answer your first question Baytril is usually given in drinking water as its quite bitter tasting and can be a bit strong on the tissues inside the beak

 

In cases where the bird isnt isolated, shuns the drinking water or is too sick to drink it can be given directly

 

I never give it neat and will mix it with water and syringe that (it means more syringing but its really strong stuff and must be very firery on the way down if its neat)

[libby22]

Thanks Redwing - I had no idea at all. I feel a little better now, as after her first dose, which was given by the vet, I was worried about how to give her the medicine. She had perked up a lot and was running about and eating - probably because she had passed the eggs at this point. Therefore, I took a chance and put her in the pet carrier with a dish with a small amount of bran, mixed with sweetcorn and her medicine and she ate the lot. If she had been limp and puffed up, as she was to begin with, I would have gone ahead and dosed her as the vet did, but I thought I could risk her getting about 90% of the dose, without stressing her, via the food method.

 

It has obviously worked as she had enough of the medication to give her a yeast infection! But now knowing it could have hurt her, I don't feel bad about the route I went down so thank you.

 

I have bathed her back end again this evening whilst she happily munched mealworms. I added the ACV to the water and she must have felt something as she kept on looking back each time I sponged her down. The smell was not as strong as yesterday and she wasn't as messy either. The sore patch looks as though it is tightening up, as a scab would and the edge is coming away slightly. She is having three small lots of yoghurt a day and drinks it down so hopefully it is helping, that and the ACV in the water and some Avipro. Vet tomorrow though, just to be on the safe side.

[libby22]

Well, Pepper has just come back from the vet. She has had a thorough check up and he was most concerned at the bad level of thrush she had been landed with. Unfortunately, he went and told the other vet off, the one who had prescribed the Baytril, and said he must ensure it is absolutely required before giving it out as Pepper had returned with a severe case of thrush accompanied by a large burn to her skin caused by the constant discharge. The door to the other room was shut, but I could still hear and I felt awful.

 

This was the head vet today and he had just come from amputating some poor chicken's leg!

 

He cleaned her up, removed the large scab, which must have been painful bless her, then prescribed Canaural ear drops! He said not to think him mad, they contained all of the correct ingredients required, especially Nystatin and said they would calm the inflammation and were antibiotic and antifungal. He tipped her onto her back and she just lay there, then tipped the drops onto her back end and into her vent, at which point she leapt up yelling! He assured me that they wouldn't sting but must have been cold! I am to bathe the area with salt water each day, add the drops and that is it. He asked for a list of her diet and was happy that she was getting everything she needed.

 

I am to ring him in a week's time to let him know the outcome, rather than stressing her by taking her back again unnecessarily. Just thought I would update you in case anyone has to deal with this in the future.

 

Thank you so much everyone - you have helped me to feel I was able to do something, when I was at the point of feeling totally helpless and that has been priceless.

[Plum]

Great was worth taking her to get confirmation if a little embarrassing

[The Dogmother]

Great news that she's being treated now, and will be on the way to recovery.

[sandyhas3chucks]

for anyone interested. you can buy empty gelatin capsules. and if you are quick and heve everything ready you can fill the capsule and pop it down a gens throat fast. job done no bitter taste no harm to tissues. works with deneguard too. if you get slightly stronger capsules it gives you a little mor time, and i find a spoonful of butter help the medicine go do..own........

[libby22]

Thanks so much - all of this information is so helpful and you never know when you are going to need it