pdcambs Posted August 6, 2009 Share Posted August 6, 2009 Just a quick comment after skimming this thread, my apologies if this has already been mentioned and I missed it. If you are intending to use cardboard (rolled up) in your smoker, please first ensure it has NOT been pretreated with an insecticide. MOST corrugated cardboard is treated with insecticides during the manufacturing process and it's use in your smoker may have an undesired effect on your colony. I use old hessian potato sacks (very old ones that predate standard insecticide coatings for some packaging materials) they burn slowly producing a cool smoke the bees don't object to as much as some other smoker fuels. I was lucky enough to pick up quite a quantity off freecycle. If anyone near Cambridge wants some to try out PM me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daphne Posted August 6, 2009 Share Posted August 6, 2009 oh goodness me - I might have been poisoning them all this time "Ooops, word censored!"ody told us this at the apiary; I shall have to investigate further. Thanks for the heads up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 6, 2009 Share Posted August 6, 2009 I use old hessian potato sacks (very old ones that predate standard insecticide coatings for some packaging materials) they burn slowly producing a cool smoke the bees don't object to as much as some other smoker fuels. I was lucky enough to pick up quite a quantity off freecycle. If anyone near Cambridge wants some to try out PM me. I was telling a young lady about the old hessian sacks this week that we use to sit on to ride ponies with(old grain sacks that oats came in) Where on earth did you find those, as havent seen them for a long time, the young lady I was telling didnt believe me! They were really useful and lasted for years(I am not that ancient but do remember string sacks)..they were a bit like the Tesco hessian shopping bags?? indie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chickenanne Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 Oh I use corrugated cardboard from old boxes...... will check. Mine are doing grand, loads of them now after a colony that didn't build in the spring, then superceded queen, followed by 4 weeks of no eggs.... they have built to grat numbers now (finally!). I've also managed to get rid of a lot of the (very)old combs I inherited with the colony as they've drawn out the foundation on the new ones they ignored all summer till now (i guess they just didn't need them before). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chook n Boo Mum Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 Does that mean you've got/going to have 2 supers on? How big was your colony when you got it? Only got one at the mo & the colony started as 5 or 6 frames. I don't think I'll need the second super unless they've gone bananas & expanded hugely over the past 2 weeks...I checked them before I went away & have missed "windows of opportunity" since I got back! Sha x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daphne Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 Just seen 2 colour photos of our bee maverick presenting prizes to one of my neighbours for her best back garden (4th year in a row) and the local retired GP (who is the father of one of the boys in Keane). Fame by association!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 Who's the 'bee maverick' then Daphne? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daphne Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 well he's just a lifelong beekeeper (started when he was 5 in 1947) but with a very non-interventionist view of keeping them. He knows his stuff mind you and we were lucky to spend 2 hours with him recently harvesting honey. I think I may have been a tad-overexcited with my post - its just the local paper, but I was so surprised - he's obviously a local hero....or what do you have to do to be on the prize giving rostrum!! Or perhaps I need to get out more....yes, that'll be it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daphne Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 well an awful lot seems to have happened since my last post. Been on an apiary visit for varroa control and uniting hives, discovered OH knows a recently 'retired' (he's only 40) local BKA Chair who also believes in a 'hands off' approach and who has offered to help us if necessary, had a chat with a passionate radical at our own apiary, heard about local beekeeping politics, and unfortunately come to the conclusion that our hive is getting more and more bad-tempered and subsequently had an anxiety dream about it! I'm waiting for a visit from our mentor but he said last time he didn't think they were very nice bees. I just thought I'd post about this - steps in the journey of newbies; and not all plain sailing. One of the hives at the apiary was so docile it was untrue and another 2 were more active but not like ours. We inspected the super with no probs but they got more and more annoyed when we ventured into the brood box so we abandoned. I've also noticed they have become particularly active (not in a good going out/coming in way but in a milling about way - I've not seen many wasps but there are other unidentified flying predators) in past 10 days or so. I'm not sure if its our bad handling, their character or something else - so we can't wait to see our mentor. Apiary radical said he didn't believe in newbies being given swarms because you didn't know the character of the colony. He thought the apiary should be queen rearing and giving away/selling nuclei. Our nectar is still turning into honey in the supers and isn't capped so another query to mentor. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdcambs Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 ........ I've also noticed they have become particularly active (not in a good going out/coming in way but in a milling about way - I've not seen many wasps but there are other unidentified flying predators) in past 10 days or so. I'm not sure if its our bad handling, their character or something else - so we can't wait to see our mentor. Hi Sorry to hear you’re having problems. As well as wasps being a trouble at this time of year, so can other bees. If another colony near by has found your colony to be much weaker than itself they can start robbing out your hive, typically there will be lots of bees trying to get into your hive, hovering about the entrance. All hives should now have reduced entrances so the bees have a smaller opening to defend. If robbing starts, move the hive being robbed and put an unpopulated hive with a couple of combs of foundation in its place. If you do this the robbers will think they have cleared out their target and withdraw, if you just move the hive being robbed without putting something in it's place the robbers will search out an alternative as they expect their victim to be there. (I'm anthropomorphizing a bit I know, but you get the idea) This is the only instance where I would move a hive while ignoring the old "move it 3 feet or 3 miles" rule, as to do nothing is going to result in the demise of that colony anyway. I hope that helps, unfortunately if you wait for your mentor to turn up it will be too late to save your colony, IF it is being robbed like this (in deed I suspect it will be too late already unfortunately; so here's hoping I'm wrong) Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdcambs Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 P.S. Typically you will find robber bees will mill round the ventilation vents in the roof trying to get in that way, whereas the hives occupants would never do this. This may help to identify that behavior if you've not seen it before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daphne Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 thats interesting. I know there is another hive close by. I wonder if thats the issue. How do I recognise my own bees No, more seriously - is there any way I would recognise the honey being taken out? I don't see bees milling around the roof. We'll put the bee guard back. Mentor should be up this week. Thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdcambs Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 thats interesting. I know there is another hive close by. I wonder if thats the issue. How do I recognise my own bees No, more seriously - is there any way I would recognise the honey being taken out? I don't see bees milling around the roof. We'll put the bee guard back. Mentor should be up this week. Thank you If this is the only hive you have (no spare kit to put in it's place) your other option is to move it more than three miles away; that is IF it is being robbed. Having an alternative site 3 miles away, especially if you keep bees in an urban/town/village setting is always a good idea, for a variety of reasons. It's not easy doing diagnosis of bee problems over the phone or internet. But robbing, once started, is VERY difficult to stop. It is, in all practical senses, impossible to identify you bees from someone else’s, unless one lot is noticeably of a different subspecies, which might be identifiable using wing morphometry or DNA analysis, but that is beyond most beekeepers. If you noticed a definite increase in entrance activity and defensive behavior at this time of the year, robbing is definitely a strong possibility. Normal hive activity is bees coming and going, a few youngsters doing orientation flights where they seem to hover in front of the hive, facing the hive, but it won't be too noisy; if as you walk to the hive you notice it is unusually noisy from a distance you would otherwise not hear the bees so loudly, this is also an indication of robbing. If I were you I would try to get another beekeeper to come have a look sooner if your mentor cannot make it until next week, as robbing needs identifying and stopping ASAP if you are not going to loose your colony. Maybe you mentor can ask someone else to cover for you. It's also worth having a look inside just at dusk once things settle down, you might find the hive is already practically empty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daphne Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 OK, well it was quite full Saturday at about 5.00pm but I guess 24 hours would do it? I don't have spare kit myself but I do have access to some if nec. I went out just now and the bee activity was much much calmer than it was on Sat and Sun and earlier today - back to my 'normal'. And yes, on Sat, when they were in a bad mood, the hive was noisy, tho I couldn't say more than usual, and you had to be close to it (but they'd have to be the noisest bees in the world to compete with the cockeral noise in the garden....) I'll check again later and call my mentor. I do have an alternative for emergencies. If honey on the supers was capped would robber bees uncap it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdcambs Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 OK, well it was quite full Saturday at about 5.00pm but I guess 24 hours would do it? I don't have spare kit myself but I do have access to some if nec. I went out just now and the bee activity was much much calmer than it was on Sat and Sun and earlier today - back to my 'normal'. And yes, on Sat, when they were in a bad mood, the hive was noisy, tho I couldn't say more than usual, and you had to be close to it (but they'd have to be the noisest bees in the world to compete with the cockeral noise in the garden....) I'll check again later and call my mentor. I do have an alternative for emergencies. If honey on the supers was capped would robber bees uncap it? Tap the hive tonight with your knuckles and see if you can here a good hiss from the occupants in response, if not pop your kit on and have a look in. If it was robbing and activity is now decreasing you'll probably only have a few bees left in there. Robbers keep going until nothing is left but some unhatched brood (the wasps will probably take them) Of course, it might not have been robbing and I've been worrying you unnecessarily (hopefully that is the case and everything is fine) Alternatively, if you gat a good hiss back when you tap, and you reduce the entrance, you should be OK until your mentor gets there to have a look... fingers crossed aye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daphne Posted August 10, 2009 Share Posted August 10, 2009 Thank you I have a feeling your name is Peter or am I getting you mixed up with someone else? Will do the tap testing tonight. My bee buddy (doing this with a neighbour) has confessed to feeling very disappointed - he's been excited for years about keeping bees and now we've done it but its not quite working out as he'd hoped - so if there's bad news to be had at least we'll have some explanations for our manic bees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kermit Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 Just got back from a week away in Scotland - v nice. Needed to look at the bees, so we did this on Sunday. A little worried as it was 10 days since we were last in. What a difference - started work on new frames, more brood and stores. Saw the 'waggle dance' for the first time, then second and third - amazing how easy to see once you've seen it once. Even found the queen with little problems. A holiday has done them good too Once things go right with bee keeping, they seem to go really right. It seems such a long time since our swarm went queenless. Glad we spent the money on this new colony. Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daphne Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 good news here too - did my hive tapping in the rain last night and got my answering hum - I was so relieved; I never thought I'd be so attached! This morning hordes of them out and about so I don't think we've been robbed. I've been out all day though, neighbour sited fox and I'm in hen defence mode more than bee mode but I will get onto mentor again tomorrow if not heard from him. Thanks again PD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m100 Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 Tap the hive tonight with your knuckles and see if you can here a good hiss from the occupants in response Recent experience would show that a tap test is not conclusive, I picked up a swarm a few weeks ago and despite building up in strength with a queen in full lay they barely respond to a tap on the hive. Similarly sized colonies located adjacent to this one do respond in the usual manner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdcambs Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 Tap the hive tonight with your knuckles and see if you can here a good hiss from the occupants in response Recent experience would show that a tap test is not conclusive, I picked up a swarm a few weeks ago and despite building up in strength with a queen in full lay they barely respond to a tap on the hive. Similarly sized colonies located adjacent to this one do respond in the usual manner. Hi I'd not say the tap test is infallible. Sometimes you just cant hear the response, but if you can hear it and you have a strong colony (which is when you need to be at your most alert for swarming) it is very useful if you have a quantity of hives to check, or if you don't/can't open a hive for some reason. Tapping is not that widely used. I rediscovered it (for myself at least) after reading about it in a very old beekeeping book several years ago and have written about it online and given talks to beekeepers that included tapping, so that it is becoming more widely used. It is not 100% reliable, but does prove useful in certain circumstances, more so for experienced beekeepers with a number of hives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beesontoast Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 I routinely use tapping to check hives, especially in winter, and I often use a stethoscope to check the condition of colonies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chook n Boo Mum Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 I routinely use tapping to check hives, especially in winter, and I often use a stethoscope to check the condition of colonies. I can just see the expression on my neighbour's face if I go out to the hive armed with a a stethoscope...he already thinks I'm mad. Sorry I'm not saying this isn't a very useful tool, it simply flashed a very amusing picture into my addled little brain Sha x Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chickenanne Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 "Mammy, why's that lady listening to the box's heart?" Ah well. There are worse things to do to get your neighbours gossiping about you I s'pose! I've tried listening to mine but couldn't hear anything, so actually I reckon a stethoscope is a really good idea. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdcambs Posted August 12, 2009 Share Posted August 12, 2009 I have to get my ear almost touching the brood box to hear anything. I did buy a stethoscope, but maybe it was too cheap and nasty as I've never been able to hear much through it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lesley Posted August 12, 2009 Author Share Posted August 12, 2009 Hmmmm - a stethoscope? - that would make a nice fashion accessory to go with my pink Crocs wellies and pink Marigolds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
