My eco solution to rat problems

[Blackrocksrock]

When my stove goes in I will be investing in an eco fan - they are great and have seen one working in fact 2 working in the showroom of the stoves in grantown and it really punches the heat out - there are 2 sizes so make sure you have headroom for them!

[Olly]

Re moisture meter - excuse my ignorance but whats that for? Is it to measure the moisture in the wood?

 

Spot on - tells you whether it's seasoned enough to burn or not. I thought about one before, but reading that Times article made me think that it might be a good idea, because of what was said about green wood. They're on Amazon for £16-20 so it's not a huge investment, I think I might get one.

 

The Ecofan is a different matter! I have read some positive reviews ... I can feel temptation coming on, partly because the whole idea of it not needing any power is so fascinating, but also it would solve a problem with my stove because it isn't in the best place to heat the whole house. I'll report back if I do!

[Willow]

Does anyone use a stove theometer ? Our installer recommended we use one but a fireplace/stove shop I went into to buy one hadn't even heard of them

[Daphne]

I don't - another thing I haven't heard of!!

[chickenanne]

You mean a thermometer that you stick on the outside, the round ones ? ( technical term for it!)

 

I had one but never actually got around to using it, didn't really see the point - you can tell if it's warm enough or not by if you're still wearing your bobbly hat whilst watching telly.... though that could just be me....

 

There must be more to it than that though?

[Olly]

I bought one on Ebay. It sits on the flue pipe, and basically tells you how hot the flue gases are. I find it helpful because I wait till it's reached the optimum zone before I close down the air vent to slow down burning, before I got this I sometimes shut down a bit too soon. I expect I could have learned from experience how to judge this, but it's helped me.

 

I was also worried because apparently burning too cool a fire - even though it's hot, obviously! - can mean you deposit more tar and stuff in the chimney, than if the fire is burning at a hotter temperature. I don't know if all this is true, or if it's just designed to sell thermometers, mind you!

 

My ecofan is ordered.

[Charlottechicken]

I like the sound of the thermometer! What size ecofan have you ordered Olly?

 

I am getting excited as I will be going to Homebuilding and Renovating, and Aga will be there so I can see a SE Little Wenlock in the flesh (although just found out that Aga have a shop in Birmingham City Centre)

 

I've managed to bag a brand new moisture meter off a private seller on ebay for less than a tenner. I'm very pleased, it has a little zip up pouch and even came with the cellophane wrapped battery.

 

I am 28% water by the way

[Olly]

Gone for the two-blade, smaller size on the basis that my kitchen isn't that big. If it doesn't work as I hope, I'm confident I can sell it on eBay for not much less than I've paid for it. Was hoping it would arrive today, as I had an email saying it was being sent on Wednesday.

 

That's a bargain for the moisture meter, I think I will get one just so I can gauge what I'm burning.

[Olly]

Well, the Ecofan arrived today - it's . Put it on the stove tonight, it just fits at the back in the recommended position (behind/to one side of the stovepipe, not in front). Lit the stove, nothing happened - and then as soon as the temperature got high enough, it started whirling away!

 

It's completely silent, which is good, but I do find the flashing blades a bit distracting, as I like to sit and look into the fire. Too early to tell if it's making a difference or not, I only lit the stove about half an hour ago and I think I'll need to burn it for a few hours to see if this has any effect. I'll report back!

[DonnaS]

So, Olly. A week on - what do you think? I saw a few of these being demo'd in a local shop recently and wondered what they were. Does yours work? Is it a good investment do you think? Or did you get fed up of the whirring and flashes of silver?

 

Cheers. Donna

[Olly]

I'm pleased with it ... it's hard to gauge how much difference it's making, ideally I need to run the stove for an hour or two with it and then the same without it, and see what happens, but I definitely think the whole kitchen is warmer. Before I used to get cold 'pockets' in the room, but now it feels toasty warm all the way through.

 

I have got used to the whirling blades, tonight I've tried positioning it slightly differently so I am not seeing the blades full-on, but they are not really a problem and it is totally silent. It doesn't create a draught either, that sounds odd for a fan I know, but you don't feel air pushing out from it.

 

I'm very glad of it today as the National Grid accidentally cut my gas off while digging up the road at midday - I'm still waiting for the fitter to arrive to turn it on again and without the woodburner I'd be very chilly!

 

Is it worth £100 ... not sure. I might try some with/without experiments and report back!

[sunshinesupernova]

I'm not convinced on Ecofans.

 

However, a flue thermometer is worth it's weight on gold once you learn how to use it properly.

Edited March 10, 2010 by Guest

[Olly]

OOh, can you give advice on how to use it, please?

 

I mean I assume that you get the heat up until it's in the 'white' zone, and then keep it there without it going into the 'red' zone, and as stated above I've found it helpful to know when to reduce the air intake. Any other tips?

[Daphne]

I used to think I knew about woodburners Isn't technology wonderful

[sunshinesupernova]

first of all - it's important to set your stove up correctly for the type of fuel you are burning. I'm presuming that you are burning good, dry fuel whether it be wood or solid fuels.

 

Coal should be burned on a coal grate - with a gap between ashes and grate, as coal / smokeless fuels will burn from the bottom up.

 

Wood on the other had needs to burn on a bed of ash and burn from the top down.

 

It's a huge no-no to burn wood and coal together at the same time (other than starting kindling). Burning both together causes them both of burn from the bottom and the top. That's what they do to smelt (melt) metal - and what will literally end up happeing to internal liners and coal grates when you do this.

 

Some stoves have removable grates - or grates that you can slide bars together to stop all air supply for wood. If this isn't possible, the next best thing is to get a piece of s"Ooops, word censored!" metal plate cut to go over the bars and prevent air getting through. This additionally protects the coal grate to lengthen lifespan when not burning wood. A metal plate is also easy to whip out when you want to go back to coal.

 

As far as flue thermometers go, these should go on the flue about 12" up from the top of the appliance. Most are magnetic. There tends to be 3 marked zones on a flue thermometer : Too Low, Best Operation and Too High - or words to those effects.

 

Most stoves have two lots of vents. One lot at the top and the other lot at the bottom. I say "LOT" - because there could be one, two, three or even four dials or sliders depending on stove model and size. However many, generally they have the same purposes.

[sunshinesupernova]

the bottom vent (primary air) is a booster vent only - to be used for a few minutes until the fire is established. This should then be closed.

 

The top vent is normally an air wash that brings warmed air down a vent on to the glass to keep it cleaner longer. This initially at least should be open.

 

Temperature you are looking for on the stove thermometer will depend on the size of the appliance. With most medium sized stoves, you want to get the flue temp up to around 350deg F - larger units up to 400 > 450 deg F. Initially, the stove won't seem that hot..... and it won't be - as you are measuring the temperature of the gasses.

 

A cast iron stove is basically a big heavy storage heater. It will be a bit longer until the heat retention in the body catches up with the flue temperature.

 

Once you hit the required flue temp, you want to stabilise the burn rate. This could be by reducing air intake through air wash or by turning a damper from fully open to half open. Add no more fuel until temperature drops away to about 250deg F. NOTE - most themometers read in F and C !!!!)

 

Its a case of store the heat, release the heat, store the heat, release the heat....

 

After that, when the therm. hits the upper temperature, stabilise again.

 

Generally saves a lot of fuel this way. It's not about how much you burn - it's about how little you burn and how much you retain.

[Daphne]

I am seriously impressed by your informative posts Sunshine-Supernova; super-detailed and factual

[Olly]

That's really informative. My stove only has a single control, but I am guessing it does all those things, just in stages. I'll have to look at the instruction booklet again!

 

Very helpful, thanks - and I think I am more or less doing things right. I'm definitely getting the stove to burn for longer at a steady temperature than when I began with it as a novice last year. Woodburners need to be learned, I've found!

[sunshinesupernova]

thank you.

 

Every chimney and stove will be slightly different - same stove will draw and perfom differently 3 doors down than it will in your house.... so each one does have to be "learned"

 

if you need some help, please ask

[Aunty e]

I'll bite! We have a carron multifuel stove, so it has a grate in the bottom over an ashpan. We're burning wood on it though and to keep our fires going we seem to have to have both airvents open all the time. I did try last night burning with just the top vent open and while the fire kept going, it just smouldered with no real flames. We only tend to have one or two pieces of wood in the stove at one time, it will take 15" logs, but it's shallow so logs have to be piled up on top of each other.

 

Our stove has been a bit disappointing in terms of heat output, it's supposed to be 6.7kw, but we really don't find it heats the room. I wondered if it's because it fits very snugly into the fireplace - there's only an inch or so of clearance above it - and the hottest part of the stove tends to be the top. Mind you, the bedroom above the stove is always toasty warm, shame "Ooops, word censored!"ody sleeps in it

[sunshinesupernova]

Depends how the grate fits in.

 

If there is a bar separating upper and lower firebox chambers , the grate must stay in place. If there is nothing there and the grate is freestanding inside - ie the lining panels aren't sat in place on top of the grate ... this should be able to come out. If it does, you can burn on a 1" thick bed of ash or sand to insulate the base.

 

That'll make a difference to loading capacity, extend burn time and lower fuel consumption.

 

As for why it's sturggling to burn.... Is your wood DRY ? I mean two years cut and barn stored ? ...not outside and not undercover. Damp wood is useless and the water content will condensate - making glass black and tarring up the chimeny.

 

Another thing could be the type of wood. Use softer woods until it gets really nice and hot. Hard woods will struggle if there is not enough heat in the body of the stove to get it going.

 

Only other thing is draw. That can change with the weather (literally). Flue length and positioning affect this too - as does cold or damp chimneys. Enough incoming air supply...

 

If it's a flue system and constantly stuggling to draw (after checking the fuel) next thing would be to lengthen the flue by 500 > 1000mm. If it's a chimney that hasn't been used for years and is unlined - it could be damp and take a vbery long time to dry out...

 

6" / 150mm either side of the stove from non combustible walls in a fireplace opening is a building control reuqirement. The more air space you have around your stove, the more heat you get out. I don't tend to fit with less than 10" / 250mm above.

[Aunty e]

Wow! That's a lot to think about! I'll have to investigate my stove later as to the grate and things, and might post a piccie if you don't mind!

 

The wood is pretty damp, I dry it out indoors next to the radiator for a couple of weeks at the moment, and I'm considering ordering a bulk load of properly dried wood, as I'm not sure our woodshed full is going to dry out before next year.

 

Our chimney is fully lined, because it was rubbish essentially. There's six inches either side of the stove, but like I said, very little clearance above. Now, the stove pipe runs up to the register plate a good metre above the stove so, being a handy sort of gal, I could knock out a bit more of the chimney breast wall in order to get more clearance on it. Here is a piccie of the stove in situ, do you think this would be advisable? Or am I likely to bring the entire chimney breast down? I remember the chap muttering something about a lintel, but not exactly what he said.

 

[The Dogmother]

I'd be careful if I were you - fireplaces usually have a lintel just above the opening. It would need a builder and some supports to hold up the chimney breast while they take out and reposition the lintel.

[Aunty e]

I wondered if that might be the case, but just couldn't remember what he had said about the lintel. I might poke my head up and see if I can see where the lintel is. Or use a carefully positioned mirror and a torch. If it is just above the opening, I'll wait until the next time I have the builders in and get them to enlarge the opening. Having said that, in the upstairs bedroom the outline of the old fireplace was very clearly visible until I repapered and it's much higher than the downstairs opening, so I might be lucky.

[Aunty e]

The grate seems to have the firebricks resting on it, so I guess that means it can't come out. I've been letting the ashpan get pretty full, is that bad?

 

Stuck my head up the chimney, well poked a mirror and a torch up there and from what I can see, there is a row of bricks in an arch, like over a window, about two rows of bricks up. Is that the lintel? Cos if it is, then can I knock out the two rows of bricks below it? I don't mind an arched opening, I'll pop a nice mantelpiece round it and it'll look lovely.