Bramble Posted January 28, 2014 Share Posted January 28, 2014 Well, I'm too scared to stop giving mealies to my lot - I'd be lynched!!!!!! I was chatting about the general ridiculousness of this to a colleague at work yesterday - I often give him some of the girls' eggs, which he is always eager to receive and has, on occasions, bought mealies for the girls as a thank you ... he didn't seem remotely put off about them continuing to have mealies - I mean, if they stop having those then they can't have any more vine weevil grubs , slugs , snails , or other miscellaneous bugs that I find whilst gardening (not earthworms, of course, they are STRICTLY off limits - new girls always have to watch an instructional dvd on the differences so that my precious earthworms are NOT gobbled !!!!) Guess I might HAVE to think differently if I sold the eggs, but as I don't I think mealies will be remaining on the menu! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luvachicken Posted January 28, 2014 Share Posted January 28, 2014 Oh good, I'm glad it looks like we have decided to keep feeding them to our chooks. I did think it would take the robin quite a while to get through them all. And my girls do make such a lovely chatter when they have been given some Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted January 28, 2014 Author Share Posted January 28, 2014 My post was only my personal opinion, not advice.... please make your own decisions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickabee Posted January 28, 2014 Share Posted January 28, 2014 Don't worry dogmother. I don't think anyone would hunt you down and sue you. You're far too valuable Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickabee Posted January 28, 2014 Share Posted January 28, 2014 BTW omlet are still selling them. I'm sure if they thought there was a problem they'd stop. Just editing this, as have been on th Flyte so Fancy website. They now say they are not allowed to market their mealworms as chicken treats anymore, due to new regulations. Oh dear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted January 28, 2014 Author Share Posted January 28, 2014 Quite a few sites seem to have either withdrawn them or posted a disclaimer saying that they are only for feeding to wild birds and not domestic poultry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickabee Posted January 28, 2014 Share Posted January 28, 2014 THE ANIMAL HEALTH AUTHORITY (AHVLA) HAVE ADVISED US THAT IT IS ILLEGAL TO MARKET DRIED MEALWORMS & INSECTS AS TREATS FOR CHICKENS. DUE TO THESE EC REGULATIONS, WHICH ARE STILL IN DISPUTE, WE ARE COMPELLED TO REMOVE MEALWORMS & INSECTS FROM OUR CHICKEN TREATS SECTION AND THEY WILL NOW ONLY BE AVAILABLE IN OUR DRIED MEALWORMS FOR GARDEN BIRDS SECTION Top quality feeds from Natures Grub Company. 3.5kg (5 lit) resealable tub. Per Flyte so Fancy. What a shame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 28, 2014 Share Posted January 28, 2014 Of course we could scatter meal worms on the ground for the wild birds but if the chickens get to them first then that is not our fault Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjp Posted January 28, 2014 Share Posted January 28, 2014 one thing we need to do is stop writing that we are going to feed them to our poultry along with other non tested/licenced items that may or may not get used/feed to them that way big brother or the 2 legged rat that has reported or brought this to the attention of the men from the ministry won't have a clue what's happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoachedPlease Posted January 28, 2014 Share Posted January 28, 2014 Chickadee aren't you saying its illegal to market them for chickens. Is it actually written that it is illegal to feed the egg laying chickens with mealworms? Xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoachedPlease Posted January 28, 2014 Share Posted January 28, 2014 I think you have to be careful on a popular website like this to start saying something is banned when it isn't. The law is in DISPUTE as I understand it, so please don't start an Internet rumour. Before long people will think they can't feed mealworms to their chickens when that isn't the actual law!, It's like the ridiculous list of plants that chickens aren't supposed to eat. It flies around the chicken websites getting longer and longer, when 90% of it is nonsense! Xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickabee Posted January 28, 2014 Share Posted January 28, 2014 THE ANIMAL HEALTH AUTHORITY (AHVLA) HAVE ADVISED US THAT IT IS ILLEGAL TO MARKET DRIED MEALWORMS & INSECTS AS TREATS FOR CHICKENS. DUE TO THESE EC REGULATIONS, WHICH ARE STILL IN DISPUTE, WE ARE COMPELLED TO REMOVE MEALWORMS & INSECTS FROM OUR CHICKEN TREATS SECTION AND THEY WILL NOW ONLY BE AVAILABLE IN OUR DRIED MEALWORMS FOR GARDEN BIRDS SECTION Top quality feeds from Natures Grub Company. 3.5kg (5 lit) resealable tub. Per Flyte so Fancy. What a shame. Think this is quite clear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickabee Posted January 28, 2014 Share Posted January 28, 2014 I didn't say it was illegal, that's just a quote from another website. Poor chooks shouldn't be denied their favourite treat . I was merely pointing out what a shame it is. Have tried to find out more info on internet. If I'm successful will post it here . Sorry if I was misunderstood . I'm a pacifist, not an activist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjp Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 this is a copy of the letter/statement that the AHVLA have been sending out and that has been posted on the notice board section on practical poultry's forum just because a law is under dispute doesn't mean it can be ignored until it's repealed or deemed illegal by the High Court or the European Court it stands and as the sections been quoted are EU regs only the EU parliament or court can rule on them and that could take years AHVLA Animal Health and Veterinary Laboratories Agency PLACING ON THE MARKET OF TERRESTRIAL INVERTEBRATES, FOR USE AS TREATS OR FEED FOR POULTRY, UNDER THE ANIMAL BY- PRODUCTS (ABP) AND TRANSMISSIBLE SPONGIFORM ENCEPHALOPATHIES (TSE) REGULATIONS Dried crustaceans, such as river shrimps and dried terrestrial invertebrates, such as mealworms, are usually imported into UK in accordance with Annex XIV; Chapter IV, Section 2 of Regulation (EU) No 142/2011: "the competent authority may authorise the importation of certain materials for purposes other than feeding to farmed land animals (except for feeding to fur animals) provided there is no unacceptable risk for the transmission of diseases communicable to humans or animals". A summary of the EU ABP & TSE legislation relating to this is as follows: • Terrestrial and aquatic invertebrates imported in this way are not considered to be processed animal protein (PAP), as they have not been processed in accordance with the Animal By-Product (ABP) Regulations. » Terrestrial and aquatic invertebrates cannot be imported as feed for poultry under provisions in the ABP Regulations, which prevent the import of certain materials, including invertebrates, for feeding to farmed livestock. • Under Article 31 of Regulation (EC) No, 1069/2009, terrestrial and aquatic invertebrates need to be processed to be used in feed for farmed animals. • However, if terrestrial invertebrates are processed, in accordance with the ABP Regulations then they do become PAP and are prevented from being fed to poultry under TSE rules. • Aquatic invertebrates, processed in accordance with the ABP Regulations become fishmea! and can be used in feed for poultry under authorisation conditions, • All poultry, including those kept as 'pets' are considered as farmed animals under the Animal By-Product (ABP) Regulations and the Transmissible Spongiform Encephatopathies (TSE) Regulations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickabee Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 Isn't TSE mad cows disease ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patricia W Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 I think that's BSE..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickabee Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 Oh think I should change my name to chickadumb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickabee Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 BSE is the bovine form of TSE, just read it on the defra website. Do you think this is all beaurocracy gone mad, or should we take it seriously . Who knew that one small post could cause such a debate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kentuckyfried Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 BSE is one form of TSE- but that's not to say that cows couldn't catch another form. Theoretically birds could catch a TSE from another animal, there are lots of TSEs out there, it would just have to breach the species barrier. BSE is an example where this possibly happened- cows were fed brains etc from s"Ooops, word censored!"ie infected sheep (s"Ooops, word censored!"ie is another TSE) and it crosses the species barrier and took the form of BSE/Mad cow. It is from knowing this stuff that stops me feeding meat related products to my chickens, both egg and meat birds. So... to summarise... a bird TSE could happen that would affect chickens, and could be carried by another host. Birds are often passive carriers/hosts anyway- there was research that showed that a moose TSE in Canada was spread by crows. I don't know about many subjects, but I do know about this Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted January 29, 2014 Author Share Posted January 29, 2014 I understand that the problem is because it's considered to be an animal-based protein. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickabee Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 Have just had another read and I understand the problem is the way they're processed. Think that was mentioned earlier in this post. I'm going to check my rather large bucket (that I just bought) to see where they were processed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjp Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 BSE is one form of TSE- but that's not to say that cows couldn't catch another form. Theoretically birds could catch a TSE from another animal, there are lots of TSEs out there, it would just have to breach the species barrier. BSE is an example where this possibly happened- cows were fed brains etc from s"Ooops, word censored!"ie infected sheep (s"Ooops, word censored!"ie is another TSE) and it crosses the species barrier and took the form of BSE/Mad cow. It is from knowing this stuff that stops me feeding meat related products to my chickens, both egg and meat birds. So... to summarise... a bird TSE could happen that would affect chickens, and could be carried by another host. Birds are often passive carriers/hosts anyway- there was research that showed that a moose TSE in Canada was spread by crows. I don't know about many subjects, but I do know about this didn't BSE become CJD in humans? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickabee Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 Yes it did become CJD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoachedPlease Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 But..if any animal based protein can carry a TSE, then our chickens shouldn't be allowed to free range as live insects can also be hosts? Unless carnivores stop eating meat won't there always be a risk? confused. BSE happened because a herbivore (cow) was fed meat (sheep), which would never happen naturally,so screwing up the food chain and natural immunity etc. chickens are omnivores and natural scavengers so far more able to deal with the associated ABP microbes etc. I do wonder if there are any scientists working in DEFRA! Btw. I read the EU reg - and pet food is highlited as not being fed to farm animals for the same reason, some of our members should take note. Xx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kentuckyfried Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 But..if any animal based protein can carry a TSE, then our chickens shouldn't be allowed to free range as live insects can also be hosts? Unless carnivores stop eating meat won't there always be a risk? Sort of. except when chooks scavenge in our gardens, there doesn't tend to be anything disease causing. I guess the worry here is that if the worms are fed something infected, they could then infect the chickens as they are added into the environment rather than naturally being there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
