mullethunter Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 Right - have come across our first (hopefully minor) sticking point. We've just been given a copy of the title, and it says that in 1947 the land was sold to a private purchaser by the town corporation. At that time a covenant was put on it to say that poultry could only be kept following written consent from the council. So my question is, what should I do? Anything? Nothing? Write to the council before we buy? Keep quiet? There's certainly nothing on a whole town basis about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valkyrie Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 Our deeds have a covenant - states "no livestock" - but I have chicken "pets" and to be honest other residents have already broken the covenants in this road. I did phone the council to ask about keeping chickens and they had no problems as long as only kept hens - fine by me! I'd give the council a call and check with them, but it is a rather antiquated covenant and undoubtedly people have long broken those rules. I reckon a fair few people already have chickens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olly Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 I'd just keep quiet. Firstly, query whether 'keep poultry' means keeping a few backyard chickens - there is a difference between having a few hens as 'pets' and keeping a flock for commercial purposes. Secondly, the chances of anyone enforcing the covenant are not high - it's entirely possible that the land benefiting from it at that time (which was presumably owned by the council) has since been sold or transferred, and there's a fair chance "Ooops, word censored!"ody else knows about it or would be bothered about it. It's fairly rare for deeds like that to be available as they aren't kept any more, so your new neighbours may not be aware of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavenders_Blue Posted December 2, 2014 Share Posted December 2, 2014 Agreed - call the council and check, but I highly doubt it would be a problem. If it were me I'd probably go ahead and move the chooks in anyway, working on the basis that any potential complainant would need to know that such a covenant existed on my house, and that they would have to pay to take me to court if they wanted to enforce it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mullethunter Posted December 2, 2014 Author Share Posted December 2, 2014 Thanks all. That was what I was hoping you would say. Onward Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majorbloodnock Posted December 3, 2014 Share Posted December 3, 2014 There is a paragraph in the Allotments Act (1950) that may be relevant here. Notwithstanding any provision to the contrary in any lease or tenancy or in any covenant, contract or undertaking relating to the use to be made of any land, it shall be lawful for the occupier of any land to keep, otherwise than by way of trade or business, hens or rabbits in any place on the land and to erect or place and maintain such buildings or structures on the land as reasonably necessary for that purpose: Provided that nothing in this subsection shall authorise any hens or rabbits to be kept in such a place or in such a manner as to be prejudicial to health or a nuisance or affect the operation of any enactment The act was designed to deal with allotment gardens, but the wording seems to cover all land, which would include residential gardens. If so, it would override the covenant. Everything I've found on the web seems to agree with this, but I'm no lawyer, so you might want to clarify this. Given you'll have a solicitor to deal with the conveyancing, this is probably an ideal time to get that clarification. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beantree Posted December 3, 2014 Share Posted December 3, 2014 The quote says 'not withstanding any provision in a covenant' so the Act doesn't override it. The difficulty with Covenants is enforcing them. It is a very expensive process the Council couldn't afford I think. Having said that, if you were deemed to have breached it you would have costs awarded against you, which could easily amount to £20K. I would ignore it and play the 'pets' angle. I would also take out legal insurance with the house insurance policy which must cover you to £50K at least. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majorbloodnock Posted December 3, 2014 Share Posted December 3, 2014 The quote says 'not withstanding any provision in a covenant' so the Act doesn't override it. Could you clarify that, please? I understand "notwithstanding" to mean "in spite of", which would make the paragraph say keeping those animals is lawful even though there may be covenants saying otherwise. However, if I'm wrong, it'd be good to know in what way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olly Posted December 3, 2014 Share Posted December 3, 2014 I agree, Major - 'notwithstanding' means 'in spite of'. However, I would add that The Allotment Act has been cited in this sort of discussion before, and it's not clear whether this would in fact apply to private gardens. There's a bit on the sticky here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted December 3, 2014 Share Posted December 3, 2014 I once consulted a solicitor i know about this on behalf of a friend; his take on it was that a covenant in this sort of situation was unlikely to be enforced, and that it would be a wise precaution to check with neighbours first, asking if they'd like free eggs, and stressing that you wouldn't be keeping a cockerel, but otherwise not to worry. Good luck mullethunter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beantree Posted December 3, 2014 Share Posted December 3, 2014 Apologies Majorbloodnock, I stand corrected. My advice to Mullethunter remains the same however. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabbitfluff Posted December 3, 2014 Share Posted December 3, 2014 My house was an ex council house and had a covenant stating, rather specifically, that I couldn't keep pigeons. Bit of a northern stereotype, but I was happy as no mention of chickens or whippets or giraffes for that matter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted December 3, 2014 Share Posted December 3, 2014 I am specifically allowed to keep a pig, but no mention of chickens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mullethunter Posted December 3, 2014 Author Share Posted December 3, 2014 Spoke to the current owner today who reckons no-one except him us and the solicitors know about the covenant and that none of the neighbours would be likely to complain. On the very downside though our builder friend who came and did a 'survey' for us today (which went VERY well) gave a very rough quote for building the garage and it was WAY more than we can afford. OH is now having major doubts, and tbh if that is a fair quote he's right. Gutted. Hoping the builder's more expensive than most. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted December 3, 2014 Share Posted December 3, 2014 That's a shame. Get a few more quotes in though. Is the garage a deal breaker? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louise Posted December 3, 2014 Share Posted December 3, 2014 Try and find someone who will let you pay direct for materials and agree either a price for just the building work or a daily/weekly rate. A lot of the cost can be mark up on materials but if you pay direct the contractor is not out of pocket and there is no mark up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mullethunter Posted December 3, 2014 Author Share Posted December 3, 2014 Thanks Louise I'll try to find someone who'll let us do that. Yes DM it is a deal breaker. I'll start getting some quotes in tomorrow Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mullethunter Posted December 5, 2014 Author Share Posted December 5, 2014 Waiting for builders to come and quote but 'bank of mum and dad' to the rescue. They very kindly have offered to lend us as much as we need to get the garage built. My mum really likes the place and I thin is nearly as excited as me! Probably more actually because she doesn't have to do the buying Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luvachicken Posted December 5, 2014 Share Posted December 5, 2014 That's very kind of your parents. I hope everything works out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valkyrie Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Whoohoo! Us mums and dads always want to see our kiddiwinkies in their own castle, so I expect we'd do the same for ours when the time comes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
