stacey30 Posted July 9, 2016 Share Posted July 9, 2016 Hello, long story ahead but some advice would be great. So middle of May I noticed my Croad Langshan, Muffin didn't look great, sour crop I thought but also hunched and closing her eyes. Made an appointment and vet drained the crop and diagnosised Mycoplasma, she was treated with Tylan by syringe and kept away from flock. 2 days later I saw symptoms of Mycoplasma in a couple of hens, I called the vet out and had a home visit so a full assessment could happen. He agreed to treat whole with Tylan in the water, all flock improved and Muffin reintroduced. Month later one hen Rhodey looked unwell, granted she was older, not laying and prone to crop issues. Took her to the vet, knowing she wouldn't be coming home but at least no pain. 3 days later found Muffins sister dead in the run. Now terrified all flock were dying I called the vets again who gave me the Tylan in the water, 0.5g in 1 litre. This was for five days. 3 days after treatment finished Muffin looked I'll again. I went to the vets again who gave her metcam and Baytril by injection, she currently finishes this today being on it for 5 days. So forward to this morning I noticed again a hen breathing heavily, brought her in and gasping died in my arms. Currently no eggs for a month, 2 moulting after broodiness Lulu and Emily. 1 mother Harry with 3 chicks, Muffin (the reoccurring poorly one) and lastly Macy. Gosh it's a long story and I feel like I'm getting nowhere, i know it could still be the mycoplasma or I've looked into a illness called cornavirus. The meds aren't working from the vets and I feel disheartened sometimes by the lack of understanding, I'm always waiting a minimum of 30 mins to be seen, call every animal by name but just say 'hen' when it's my turn, but have no problem charging me the going rate. Probably spent a good few hundred pounds on appointments etc but not at all bothered by the cost, I just need to treat them correctly. I am assuming they are going to die one by one. Lost 3, 5 adults remaining and 3 chicks which are actually thriving but maybe not sleeping with elders is helping. Anyone with experience? Really trying here but seem to be getting it wrong, love them dearly but really is draining and disappointing not to be curing them. I can't see illness in anymore but Muffin is still being treated. Thanks for reading, bit of a long story Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beantree Posted July 9, 2016 Share Posted July 9, 2016 I'm wondering if it isn't some other kind of virus Stacey? Perhaps a blood test would be an idea? An obvious question is when were they last wormed with Flubenvet because a heavy worm burden will weaken their resistance to anything going? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mullethunter Posted July 9, 2016 Share Posted July 9, 2016 It sounds like what Redsunset had in her flock - if you look up the posts you'll find it documented Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stacey30 Posted July 10, 2016 Author Share Posted July 10, 2016 Ok, will look up symptoms that Redsunset had and see where to go from there. Worming due next month, all such a worry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cat tails Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Here is the post of Redsunset. She got a few infected chickens from an auction. Did you have any recent additions that could have brought something in or did you visit someone with chickens yourself? Hope you get it sorted. Ps: look at April 1st post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted July 10, 2016 Share Posted July 10, 2016 Hmmm, not sure it is Myco; it is serious enough, but very rare for them all to die, especially with AB treatment. I would get a 2nd opinion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kopperdrake Posted July 12, 2016 Share Posted July 12, 2016 Where are you based? If you're anywhere near the East Midlands, we use Minster Vets - they have a very specialised poultry service which would tell you what you have, but they do charge. However, I don't remember them being worse charges than a standard vet, and they seriously know their stuff. They have poultry specialists in York, Hereford, Sutton Bonington, Leominster, Carlisle, Lancashire and Wrexham. http://www.minstervets.co.uk/contact Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted July 12, 2016 Share Posted July 12, 2016 Poultry specialist vet here in Banbury too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stacey30 Posted July 15, 2016 Author Share Posted July 15, 2016 I'm in Somerset, vets have basically said I've tried all options with Muffin. Baytril, Tylan powder and Tylan liquid hasn't cured her illness. 8 times I've been to the vets. She is eating but only sweetcorn. Still dribbly, sleepy and hanging out downstairs with me. I am struggling to find more vets in my area that can deal with chickens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ursula123 Posted July 15, 2016 Share Posted July 15, 2016 Looking on the BHWT website, there are chicken vets in Axminster and Crewkerne. Have a look at their website BHWT.org.uk under hen health, there is a map with chicken friendly vets listed. Hope this helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daphne Posted July 15, 2016 Share Posted July 15, 2016 OK, so I don't have a magic answer either, but a few things occur to me. There are various strains of myco, some worse than others. The best thing to treat a bad strain of myco is intravenous tylan - ie by injection. Others may correct me if they know of something more up to date. Tylan in the water is not much good against an aggressive strain as birds are too poorly to drink properly. However, the number of deaths concerns me, as DM says, I too would be surprised if myco was killing so many. I would first do my utmost to find an avian vet, and possibly I would get an autopsy. I wouldn't rule out something else going on, but its too difficult to predict what it might be from scant knowledge. Its distressing for you, and I sincerely hope you get it sorted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stacey30 Posted July 17, 2016 Author Share Posted July 17, 2016 Thank you for your help. Hens are looking ok so far but Muffin still not 100%. I will contact a vet from Bhwt list, my vets didn't even call back on Friday when I just wanted to check if they could recommend what to do next. I didn't feel the Tylan in the water did much, Tylan liquid by mouth Muffin really struggled to swallow it even when taken really slowly, vet did one injection of Tylan with some metcam but only once. I have metcam but nervous to administer this as its for dogs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beantree Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 Metacam is an anti-inflammatory and painkiller Stacey, so no use whatsoever for your hen's condition. The dog dosage is far too high for chickens and should be halved (despite what our vet said). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted July 17, 2016 Share Posted July 17, 2016 That's because Tylan is very bitter. Ask the vet for the injectable form, and some lessons in injecting; it isn't hard. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stacey30 Posted July 18, 2016 Author Share Posted July 18, 2016 Have spoken to my vets and they are contacting Langford for testings. 2 look poorly today and I can see yellow growths in the mouth. Maybe canker/Trichomoniasis? Any experience of this? Waiting hear back on next step but I think my local vet is recommending a postmortem on a hen. Wondering now if it's been this all along? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackrocksrock Posted July 18, 2016 Share Posted July 18, 2016 Goodness - that does not sound very good and hope you get to the bottom of it now. Worth getting it diagnosed properly although I know it costs a lot for the tests - you really need to know. Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted July 18, 2016 Share Posted July 18, 2016 Sounds like it might be canker.. it is treatable, but nasty. From memory it requires metronidazole, but i may be mis-remembering Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavclojak Posted July 19, 2016 Share Posted July 19, 2016 Yep, it is metronidazole.....before when my hens had sour crop, before the correct diagnosis canker was suggested and metronidazole was the drug of choice but will have to purchased off licence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stacey30 Posted July 19, 2016 Author Share Posted July 19, 2016 Called vets again and said the symptoms of dribbling, eating less, gasping, visible yellow lumps in the mouth is pointing to Canker not mycoplasma. In all the visits I don't remember them checking inside any mouths although I believe it can also be lower in the throat? Forever taking their temperatures and prescribing Baytril, metcam, Tylan etc but was this ever going to shift canker? No vets available to talk to but passed a message to see if they will prescribe me metronidazole. Slightly feel they will be resistant to this, I'm not wanting to do their job but really need them to listen to me and consider this could be the answer. Yesterday they suggested culling one (3 showing signs, 5 not) for a definite diagnosis and testings at Langford animal centre but will only deal with me through the vets and not personally give me an appointment. Other local vets are all run by the same company so that's not going to help by moving, part of the problem as well I think is I have seen at least 4 different vets so they never have the exact background or a specialist on chickens I am reluctant to lose another hen without treating all before to give this one final attempt. Thanks for all your responses I find them incredibly helpful. Always welcome opinions and advice, is this the best way forward? I just hope that this is the answer and I can treat them in time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gavclojak Posted July 19, 2016 Share Posted July 19, 2016 It's difficult isn't it, I had two vets one for my dogs and one for the hens, my dogs vet suggested it when he told me I probably know more about hens than he does! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beantree Posted July 19, 2016 Share Posted July 19, 2016 There are two different 'cankers' Stacey. One is a fungal infection in a sour crop, the other are lesions (combination of inflammation and ulceration) caused by a reaction to a parasite called Trichomonas Gallinae. It will be the latter you can see. It responds well to Flagyl and is contagious, spreading by saliva in water and feed, so the whole flock will need treating. This is a condition that overtakes birds rapidly, but only surfaces when birds are out of condition for other reasons (worms, old age, injury, infection, virus, moving stress), in my experience. We have a flock of Orpingtons with it and it originally came with the mother hens we bought in from a breeder; a good reason not to hatch with a broody as they will transmit it to the chicks. It lives in the airways and they can block up before canker is seen in the throat. Our infected flock is treated orally regularly with onion juice (or just chopped onions if they will eat them) which is very effective. We did treat a cockerel for it whilst in quarantine (another bought in from a breeder) with Flagyl with complete success. Towards the end of his years he became very ill, but the cankers did not appear, so clearly he wasn't carrying TG. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stacey30 Posted July 19, 2016 Author Share Posted July 19, 2016 Thank you for that information Beantree. Trying to figure out how it spread but my first poorly hen Muffin I assume contracted this illness after a possible crop issue/myco? Sadly the girls that have died left their sisters/partner which probably has stressed them as well. I'm due to worm in the next few weeks but have held back as they aren't eating as much as usual and wouldn't feel they had enough dose. The vet has given me the solution metronidazole for the water, 40ml for 2 litres, not Flagyl. Is Flagyl in a tablet form? I thought treating the lot by water especially in this heat may be better than stressing them out catching them individually for a tablet. Vet agreed that I can use this method next though if it doesn't improve. 5 days worth to go, hoping this is it and I can help them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stacey30 Posted July 19, 2016 Author Share Posted July 19, 2016 It's difficult isn't it, I had two vets one for my dogs and one for the hens, my dogs vet suggested it when he told me I probably know more about hens than he does! Wow, good he was honest though! I think this forum has helped me more than the vets has. They are great with my dog but not so much with my girls. They told me to consider a restock if this treatment doesn't work Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grandmashazzie Posted July 19, 2016 Share Posted July 19, 2016 Flagyl is just the brand name for metrodiazonale so hope it helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stacey30 Posted July 19, 2016 Author Share Posted July 19, 2016 Flagyl is just the brand name for metrodiazonale so hope it helps. Oh good, thank you for that info-worried it wasn't the same Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
