Nacktschnecken omlet Cube

[BERTIE MCSQUIRTY]

here i am sitting up at about 1/2 1 in the morning when i should be in the land of nod worrying again about my sons education

 

He is 8 (9 in sept) and is in the head's class at school he loves anything to do with maths or science, not interested in much sport, quite creative but i wouldn't say he was an academically gifted child in any sort of way.

last school year his teacher described him as being by far in front with his maths and science. not suprisingly really as his hobbies include anything to do with this subject, nurturing his science interest has been quite easy due to museums, tv docs, online school and science sites, and by choice he would choose a chemistry or biology set above anything else to play with.

 

now this year he comes home with maths homework to be completed throughout the week, he usually does this within 1/2 an hour then says "i'm bored" and only very rarely gets an answer wrong, he gets umpteen merits for maths so i end up giving him more questions based on what he has been given. to give you an example of what he's like, he will see a number and then play "lets fraction it" rather than something like i spy in the car. he also chooses to buy national geographic magazine, gets grandad to collect tokens from the daily mail on science subjects (yes we've got boxes of them). his bedroom wall consists of posters about dinosaur and sea mammal bone structure, astronomy, insects birds, reptiles...you name it the list can go on, he can name most species of shark.

 

so... with this in mind i spoke to the teacher a couple of months ago and said that Ds is bored with his homework, that he needs stretching and that he is finding his maths quite easy. to date nothing further has materialised.

 

at the weekend i saw him assist a 10yr old who was struggling with maths homework, for ds to answer it far more easily than i could ever explain it!

 

tonight he tells me that he is having to take time out of maths to teach another child in the class the 2x table ( a child who is in day 2 of his entire school life) and he is not happy and very upset about it, also he is a communcation peer during maths for an autistic boy in his class, where they go off and spend time in an emotions class (my lad is quite a quiet boy - but he likes to sit, watch and listen and does get involved in class )

 

my hubby is going up the wall over this tonight - not that he objects to him helping others, but not at such a basic level - also why remove him from part of a lesson which he adores?

 

what can i do? is there anything i can do to encourage his natural love of a subject, even though we are not maths minded people ourselves(its completely beyond me!!), we've exhausted the maths workbooks in wh smiths that he chooses with his pocket money

 

should i again address this with the teacher? or should i pay out for extra tuition (his ideal out of school club would be a science club where he could make volcano's fizz, collect insects, search for fossils etc - but there's nothing like that round here).

 

any constructive advice would be gratefully received

[patsylabrador]

Is home education out of the question? We did it, hard work, masses of fun and they can still go on to uni etc. The best thing is that they have the time to explore the subjects they love.

[patsylabrador]

(his ideal out of school club would be a science club where he could make volcano's fizz, collect insects, search for fossils etc

Just wanted to add, this is how we would spend our days. It's idyllic. River tributaries were fun because that involved playing with water on hot summer days, pouring water down specially constructed slopes. Water and mud - great way to learn.

Lots of people argue that they won't get a proper social life and will be misfits, trust me, that's rubbish.

[Chucky Mama]

I have a 12 year old who is gifted and particularly so in maths. He has a very good maths teacher who is enjoying having a student to run with. However his teacher did get grumpy with him last week when he told him that there was a better way of working something out and when he explained his way the children agreed (oops!). I would ask for a sit down with the head of maths to talk through your concerns. It is standard for them to use our bright sparks to help out others but not to this extend. As a year 7 my son is doing year 9 work and looking at some year 10. In terms of out of school activities I would contact NAGC http://www.nagcbritain.org.uk/ they gave me very good advice re my children. I don't do any maths, science etc out of school. We do sport - if he is not good at sport there are lots of stats that he can play with connected to sport, chess (great strategy), music (many that are good at maths are great at piano & music), nature & the environment(science and lots of stats involved). Even shopping is great - I get YS to add up the shopping as we go around the supermarket. If he is within 5p he gets yummies By doing this you can broaden their knowledge and also deal this the sociability issues that many of these gifted children can have - it doesn't have to be an issue. Good luck, I know how awful it is trying to get what your children need in school as noone wants to come across as a pushy parent and the children hate any parental intervention especially when they are at secondary school.

[Laura & CTB]

I had a similar situation when my son was 8 - he loved maths and got bored very quickly in class.

I went and discussed it with his teacher - there was an easy solution - they put him up a year for maths class and every year after that until he left primary school which was more challanging for him.

 

(he is now just about to complete his maths degree and go into teaching)

 

Hope you get this sorted soon.

[bronze]

Sounds like they're not doing enough for him

I have a MathsMatt as he likes to call himself. Hes in year 2 but school have happily put him up to year 4 for maths as keeping him busy and occupied is easier for everyone.

[The Dogmother]

I think that you really need to get in there and give them a shove; I am happy to stand corrected here, but I think that they are obliged to match the talents of each of their pupils, stretching those who need it rather than using them as an extra teaching resource. The trick is to find a teacher who is sufficiently interested in nurturing these children rather than just letting them get on with it.

 

Rosie is 12, and she has G&T status in 4 of her subjects, currently working 1-2 years ahead of her age in all of them; I have had regular meetings with her teachers to ensure that they are stretching her enough and that she remains stimulated. There's a G&T website (the address of which escapes me right now) that has loads of extra tasks they can get up to. I mix maths and other subjects into our weekend activities.

 

Good luck, and get in there.

[Cinnamon]

Is there a head of Maths at the school? - if so,I would have a word with them

 

Your son deserves to be nurtured in his talent,just as much as those who struggle deserve help, & IMHO its wrong that he is acting as a sort of second teacher in his class.I would be livid

 

Can you help with his interest in maths by taking him to a club that is independent from the school maybe? Or even a Chess club?

[paddy1709]

I agree with all the above. However I wouldn't panic too much. I come from a family where we are all pretty good with figures. My brothers went through the comprehensive system with mixed year groups and both achieved to their ability. Any other subject and I would be panicking. I have a degree in maths and my five year old son also has a very good grasp of numbers (he can multiply, divide and came to me the other day that infinity was a lazy and I am not even sure that the school has picked up on it yet. It doesn't concern me as I have always just wanted for my children to enjoy school. (PS My daughter age 7 has a complete block much more worrying!

Also I teach maths in my spare time to GCSE and A level for family and friends and as long as the pupil has a good grasp of number the syllabus can be taught in a few months believe it or not.

[Busybird]

I would tread carefully. Assuming you do not wish to move your child to a different school you do not wish to be known as troublesome. My three kids are all G&T in maths and science (plus other subjects). Having researched and thought carefully about options I have had numerous meetings with their teachers and the headteacher at our local primary school about how to stop them getting bored in school. I have never had a satisfactory outcome and, on one occasion, was accused of being a bad mother for wishing to push my children.

 

We now try to deal with this outside of school. The kids go on G&T enrichment weekends (expensive but working with children more equal to them academically). Our local WIldlife Trust has a 'Watch' group for kids where they do loads of nature science stuff in a fun environment. We have taken them on bat watches, fossil hunts and loads of walks along canals and railway lines to check out engineering and wildlife. At home we buy DVD's like Brainiacs, Blue Planet, Planet Earth, Walking with Dinosaurs and so on. We have researched the various computer 'games' like Mathletics and Scratch that allow them to compete against others in maths challenges and start learning about computer programming.

 

I considered home educating but did not have the confidence to go down this route.

 

Now that my older two are at an excellent comprehensive things are working out better. They have both represented their school in maths challenges (my son's team won, my daughters came second) and my daughter has taken part in a county science fair (she won a silver award for her entry). They are still way ahead of most of their peers but a big, well run school can offer them challenges. Our small village school failed them miserably.

 

The hardest thing I found was keeping them positive about education so that they wanted to learn when they had to spend so many hours of every day being totally and utterly bored. Look at what they find fun and challenging and encourage that. Good luck!

[ubereglu]

I sadly know what this is like, as through primary school my life was often like this. However Year 4 was better as I had a wonderful teacher who pushed me and knew I could do the work. There are some great science books out there at the minute where you can do practicals in your kitchen. We have one at home which I think he'd probably enjoy. It's called 'Science for fun experiments', see the link here. Then it gives you another aspect to look at and he can do his own research type projects at home and get interested in science that way.

 

My sister would sympathise a lot with the situation you are finding yourself in, as she has been having similar problems teaching one of her Year 5s. It's really hard to get the balance right though and I think it would be good if you encouraged him to pick up some other interests too so then he becomes a well rounded individual.

[A chickychickychick-ENN!!]

Is this any good for you, for the naturey stuff?

 

http://www.lrwt.org.uk/pp/gold/viewgold.asp%3Fid=3019.html'>http://www.lrwt.org.uk/pp/gold/viewgold.asp%3Fid=3019.html

 

I volunteer with my local Trust and the kids love it. Wildlife Watch membership is very good.

 

http://www.lrwt.org.uk/

[Chucky Mama]

I misread your post as your son being in year 8 rather than being 8 which can be tricker. My children went to a small primary where they slid up and down years to keep them going. They school didn't like them to cross a keystage (being taught in keystage 2 when they were keystage 1), but it had to happen for one of mine. Moving up a year works until they get to the top of school. My ES effectively did year 6 3 years running but had a great teacher that broadened the curriculum for him. YS was bored out of his skull in maths for 3 years and taught himself Printed sheets are awful but often seems to be all that is on offer.

Having been there, I would advise broadening your son outside school, don't plough throught the curriculum whatever you do as it will just make his life more boring at school. Go for the hobbies that can stimulate his mathmatical mind. Plus, relax he wont stop being clever, there is not expiry date on his great brain When he gets to secondary school he will run and run and it is really exciting seeing them grasp the curriculum with both hands and go for it. My children were in a way held back at primary school but they grew socially such a huge amount and are now so much more well rounded because of it. They are now loving the fact that they are stretched, which can't be said for the 'geeky' kids that have only been pushed academically who struggle to fit in.

[Seagazer]

I'd really hope that by now they would have sorted out how to deal with the more gifted children. My DD's first teacher at primary was very sniffy about the fact that DD was already reading at an advanced level, and this happened to one of our friend's daughters as well who was in the same class. She was so narrow minded and the poor girls got so bored.

 

I think you should perhaps arrange to see the teacher again and then perhaps if you don't get anywhere see the head teacher. There is no harm in having a tutor too. We've done it for two of our children now.

[BERTIE MCSQUIRTY]

thanks for your wonderful replies and suggestions.

 

i have again this afternoon had a word with the head & share class teacher of our very small village school, at first they denied that he had done this tuition, but eventually i did get out of him that yes ds had finished earlier than expected and was asked to assist another pupil, who was at entry level basic maths.

 

with regards to his maths - he is already working on a year above his level, but perhaps they will consider stretching him more to keep him interested.

they did last year talk about him joining an extra group to bring on these skills, however, they thought he would benefit more with other projects at school to bring out his positives such as on school council etc.

 

the communication group happens only very occasionally with an education welfare officer, and can be arranged during any lesson plan so not partuculary during a planned maths / science session, they state that although he is usually quiet, he does relate and has worked well with the child who needs this "therapy" - i dont see this as a bad thing as he can be quite deep in thought, and he is quite fond of this boy.

 

i was just upset last night as he went to bed at 8, and was up and down til after 10.30 worrying about this (which i have explained to teacher)

[Chucky Mama]

Well, it's a start isn't it. I would perhaps plan another meeting to check on progress in the near future. It is difficult as you don't want to be seen as a pain. Small village schools are great but can be a problem if your child is poking out of the top in terms of ability. If there is only 1 bright spark it is easier to overlook them. If there are a few they keep each other going and they have to be catered for. My YS has taken a while to mentally mature as he has grids of numbers sitting in his head that can be very distracting (eek - I am not at all mathematic and this scares me!). So, in a way he did benefit from not being pushed too much until secondary school as he has learned to order his mind a little better.

[paddy1709]

Great Post Chucky Mama. Primary school is for feeling and starting how to learn. It is not preparation for exams etc. I wholeheartedly agree with the statement on a good brain will always be there- secondary school is the time to focus.

Anyone that has been bought up around a seriously mathamatical family will agree that developing the person to be able to deal in a social context so to able to function later on in work and relationships is much more important.

I know that this may sound contentious - but I don't think constantly stretching always works. There were many times when i was bored at school but had to get on with it . Surely dealing with boredom is sometimes a requisite for life.

[patsylabrador]

There were many times when i was bored at school but had to get on with it . Surely dealing with boredom is sometimes a requisite for life.

Absolutely, I always made sure the kids had time to be bored. It gives the brain time to think, even if it's just daydreaming and as you imply it's good training for adulthood. I also think it's important for them to know that being on their own is good at times and that you don't always have to be surrounded by friends. To be self reliant is a good life skill.

[P&P]

The website www.nrich.maths.org has lots of activities to enthuse and stretch gifted mathematicians at all key stages - could the school be encouraged to give him some problems and puzzles to tackle if he has easily completed the required work?

 

Pauline

[The Dogmother]

Thanks for that site Pauline, Rosie will love it,

 

I totally agree that childeen need time out just to be children, get into s"Ooops, word censored!"es and get bored - essential life skills.

[BERTIE MCSQUIRTY]

just for clarification - i never said he was gifted, he is just enthusiastic and enjoying these subjects that seriously interest him.

 

he also gets "bored" with creative writing activities, unless its on a subject he likes, some sports etc, but he accepts this as how it should be, but he does give 110% effort every time or so i am told (at home he's like any other child - stroppy, fights with his sister, never helps out without a moan etc).

 

e.g. during his recent homework for end of term he had to do a presentation on WWII, he put it off and off until the absolute last warning from me, so he chose to do a poster on what adaptations were made on the planes for bombs to be successful in causing maximum damage, he used 2 examples of dropping feathers from a height and dropping a brick to demonstrate this and wrote an accompanying piece to it, this is how his mind works!! i wouldn't have thought of that!!

 

p.s i have been given the website nrich for him today, and he went on for a while before tea and whilst i was cooking

[AJuff]

I find your post particularly interesting as my DS was in a similar position. At the end of first school we made the decision to move him to an excellent private school as it was very academic. It has brought out his sporting side very well and as for his maths . . . well lets just say he has gone from top dog in a small school to average in a highly academic school. He is thriving on the challenge. Have you considered moving to a larger school?

[BERTIE MCSQUIRTY]

I find your post particularly interesting as my DS was in a similar position. At the end of first school we made the decision to move him to an excellent private school as it was very academic. It has brought out his sporting side very well and as for his maths . . . well lets just say he has gone from top dog in a small school to average in a highly academic school. He is thriving on the challenge. Have you considered moving to a larger school?

 

 

not really - though i have thought of private school nearby, but i'm sure it will be out of my budget as i would have to give both my children equal opportunities, one i could afford, but not two. i am entitled to allow my children to attend gordonstoun due to my family history at a very reduced rate, however that is over 500 miles away and i couldn't do that.

[chickencam]

This is a very difficult issue.

 

In an ideal world every child would be stretched to achieve their full potential. This becomes easier at secondary school, but is very difficult in a small primary. I used to help in my YD's class when she was in key stage one and always felt that it wasfar more important to give extra help to the children who were struggling with reading and maths. These children are mainly struggling not as a result of lack of ability, but because they come from homes where learning is not the norm. A child who is given stimulating resourses from an early age will engage with learning with ease, whereas in some homes this just doesn't happen. If these children are not encouraged at this early age they will soon become disinterested in learning and it is the start of a slippery slope which is such a shame.

 

The school to some extent has to employ a one size fits all policy and it is largely down to the family to encourage individual interests. You sound like you are doing a great job with your child, have you asked the school if he can bring in his own work to do during maths sessions, so that he is not bored? It could also boost his self esteem no end to be able to help others who are struggling, because as they achieve results he will feel very proud of what he has done.

 

Good luck, being a parent is a job that comes with so much worry and so many dilemas.

 

Our latest dilema is ED's sixth form choices. She is already at a high achieving girls grammar school, but has been offered a place at one of the best state schools in the country for her A levels. She is now unsure whether to go this school for it's excellent reputation, or stay where she is with her friends. It never ends.

[paddy1709]

Gosh I always post on contentious issues! Sorry

I have to disagree with the previous post. My children compared to other children have been late readers. Prior to school I let them play fully so when they eventually went to school it was to learn from the very beginning. Consequently it may be seen that they were behind other children academically. However the school confirmed to me that learning to read early is not an indication of academic ability. My mother also confirmed this to me and reiterated that my brother couldn't read by eight however as soon as he could flew along and eventually got a good solid degree in classics.

I am posting as I would hate to think that my children are to be judged so early in terms of academic prowess.

Not looking for a debate just putting my experience across!