Unsecure chicken perches

[Cinnamon]

My eldest could go to Uni next year,but still doesn't know what to study.

As she needs to start applying in September,this is a bit of a problem

 

Anyhow,she said last night that she may take a year out,do some work enabling her to be able to pay her way through Uni a year later.

However,she is VERY set in her ways - she hates change,& I know the thought of living away from home horrifies her.

I suspect that this is part of the problem & that she will never go if she doesn't go in 2011.

 

That said,I want to support her decisions, & have been pondering a few things.

Firstly,she doesn't want to apply or even think about a personal statement this year - I feel that this is a mistake as she can always defer her entry (but there again,she isn't sure what to study)

 

Secondly,her tutor said that if she took a year out it will be harder for her to get into Uni when she does decide to go.Furthermore,if she took a year out to work,it is not looked upon favourably against someone who has taken a year out to travel & broaden their minds.

 

Lastly,should she take this year out I suspect that she thinks she can spen a lot of time in her room,playing computer games

Should I be looking at ground rules.......up by 9am, responsible for own laundry,paying rent for her keep & so forth???

[chickencam]

We will be in a similar position this time next year I suspect. ED is starting A levels in Spetember, she hasn't a clue what she wants to do, apart from a vague interest in teaching. She is talking about working for a year before university. I would have hoped that showing some self reliance and willingness to take control of her finances should be looked upon very favourably, rather than taking a year out for going on jollies Not all travellers do voluntary work and broaden their minds and awful lot just have a year off.

 

I would be inclined to put in place some ground rules, to show her what real life and the world of work is really like. She will after all be an adult by then.

 

Just going down the university route because 'everyone' does isn't a good idea, so taking a year out, will make her another year more mature and let her decide on her own priorities.

[Cinnamon]

Thats my way of thinking too.

She is lucky in that she works at Waitrose,& I am almost certain that they will take her on for another year,probably giving her more hours as well.

 

She is (& she won't thank me for this) fairly immature for her age,a fact compounded by us being very rural & her having to rely on me to get anywhere. I feel she needs to be less reliant on me really, & suspect a year working will help with that.

However,al her friends are going to Uni,so I worry that she will retreat into her room,as is her tendency even now

 

Now,what about her contributing to the household accounts - £25 a week or so?

I think this will help her to understand that she needs to work (& I may even put the money aside rather than use it for groceries & bills,for her to have when she does go to Uni.not that I will be telling her this!)

[patsylabrador]

My daughter didn't initially want to go to university so went to work for a couple of years and then decided she wanted to take a biology degree. Firstly she did a foundation science year to get up to scratch and has just completed her degree.

The beauty of this was that because of her work experience she had a good part-time job to help fund her through and she has now converted to full time until she can get a job in her chosen field. She went to a university within driving distance so didn't need to leave home, and it's all worked out nicely.

She certainly didn't face the problems that your daughter's tutor has said will happen.

If she has a job she can afford to go abroad anyway, so that problem would be solved.

[chickencam]

That sounds like a great idea to me.

 

My Daughter is very self contained too, her friends all live 20 miles away, this is as a result of going to an all girls grammar school 9 miles from home that takes it's pupils from a very large catchment area. YD is about to start the same school and she has so far on taster day made friends with some girls who live 30 miles away This does mean that they are far less subject to peer pressure and ED has certainlty found that she has more time to spend doing things that she really enjoys like discovering her interest in dressmaking, which she is now spreading amongst her friends.

 

If my daughter does take a year out I will be encouraging her to take some evening or one off courses in the things that interest her. At the moment she is looking for a course to do next summer on corsetry and unwear making which is something that wants to learn more about.

[Chickendoodle]

My ED travelled around Oz etc for a year and decided to get a job when she got back. Found a temp position in Social Services, loved it, turned out to be very good at it, and at age 25 has just finished the first year of a Social Work Degree course (working in the holidays in social services still)

 

Social work never crossed her mind until she got the temping job. Uni doesn't have to be at age 18 or 19 and my ED is very pleased that she didnt end up doing a degree in something relatively useless! As she is a mature student she has also qualified for various grants and bursaries.

 

Your daughter might not be ready for uni now (if at all). Agree re firm ground rules if she is still living at home though

[Lewis]

I can see where you're both coming from - upping sticks, leaving home and being chucked in with a bunch of strangers for 3 years can seem quite scary especially if you aren't set on a specific career path.

I still don't feel old enough to leave home and go to Uni but in 8 weeks I'll be there

 

 

I'd definitely think if she chooses to do a gap year, to apply for UCAS 2011 anyway - she'll get used to how to apply, can always defer a year which will more likely mean it will happen, and if for any reason she didn't get a place on a couse she could change her mind or ask for feedback for the next time around

She'll have all the help she needs from school this year too - on her own next year. School will need to write references and stuff, which might be harder to sort next year?

 

 

There are soo many courses to choose from - she must have a vague idea, have a look at the EPs on the UCAS website and some will look more interesting than others. I spent weeks on that website

Any related Work Experience will help to decide too, and help on her PS.

 

Some of my friends are doing gap years for different reasons - grades, travelling and being lazy The ones that have applied + deferred, I think will be the ones that go but the others that are working or travelling will stay here and not go. The same has happened with last years Upper 6th - they've tried to become friends with some of us 'cos all their friends have gone to Uni, they're staying here and now we're the ones leaving.

Its not for everyone though, its kind of expected (here at least) that you'll do A levels and then go to Uni, but everyones different.

 

Sorry for the essay!

[The Dogmother]

A bit of a quandary there Sarah, and I agree with what Lewis and Liz have to say, in fact I have been having a similar discussion with a friend who's daughter is at the same stage.

 

Working won't do her any harm and will (with some help from you) increase her independence. I would also recommend that she starts looking for some work experience in areas that interest her so that she can build up some idea of whether or not she wants to study that subject. If the retreating into her room is a problem, then why not move her computer (or whatever she is doing up there) downstairs to a communal area so that you can see more of her and she can interact with you more - sorry but you can probably tell that I'm not a fan of computers or TVs in bedrooms

 

I took a year out 30 years ago when it just wasn't done; I worked to fund myself through college, and also did some voluntary work abroad. It was a real eye opener and I was offered 2 jobs by companies that I was working for.

 

Good luck, and I hope that she understands that what you are suggesting is for the best.

[Old Speckled Hen]

I think she should apply for a place then defer for a year. She can always change subjects nearer the time surely and will have the insurance of a definite place.

As your daughter has a job already then at least she can start that saving. And she must have that job rather than sitting around at home. My daughter got her place at Cambridge then spent six months on Raleigh International and BSES then five months teaching sailing. I was a widow with an only child then and I dread to think how I'd have coped with her simply strapping on a rucsac and heading East.

[chickenanne]

I do agree that if she isn't ready to go to uni then it makes good sense to defer a year, but I would be scared of it becoming a "comfortable rut" which would be difficult to pull herself out of. I would be very wary of seeing a year spent living at home, working part time in a relatively non-challenging job, particularly if she is going to need lifts etc to and from work /social life, as it doesn't sound that much like it would lead to a blossoming of independence, or help her clarify waht she wants to do in the future.

 

Spending even 3 months of the 12 months away from home living independently, budgeting (time and money) herself, and doing something pretty challenging would be a better option IMO. Maybe she could spend 6 months working to save cash for a 6 month stint doing something more challenging would be feasible? The initial few months of earning money/having left school whilst living at home would give her a slightly "softer landing" whilst making her more independent, such that after a few months she could be far more ready for some new challenges.

[milli]

In my experience (left uni 4 years ago, hubby left 2 years ago) people who take a year out to work are definitely not looked down upon compared to travellers or people who have gone straight there. Working for a year is a great way to mature and discipline yourself so that when you do go back to study you appreciate and work hard for it.

 

If she doesn't know what to do a year out is good and will give her time and if all her friends are going then that might provide her with the motivation to apply for the next year. I wouldn't advise applying and defering unless she has at least a vague idea of what she wants to do (going to uni to do any old degree just because you think you should do something is not a great idea) and if after a year she is still not fussed then maybe uni and all the debt that goes with it is just not for her.

 

The only thing that I would suspect might make it harder the year after is that she wont have the support of tutors and the school to help with the application.

 

I would definitely put in place some ground rules so that she realises that work isn't the easy option though.

 

Good luck with it all

[Old Speckled Hen]

 

Spending even 3 months of the 12 months away from home living independently, budgeting (time and money) herself, and doing something pretty challenging would be a better option IMO.

 

Absolutely.

My daughter was a changed person after her Raleigh stint.

[Cinnamon]

Just had a good old chat with her,in the sun.

 

She has only just got out of bed

 

She agrees that if she does have a year out,there will be ground rules.

She wasn't happy about taking an evening class at college,as she says she wants a brak from studying.....

 

As for the job & saving - well,she has already saved £1000 in her Uni fund from her wages,plus paid for herself to go to Sicily a couple of weeks ago - she is good with money

 

We chatted about her possible going to Reading Uni, which is only 20 mins drive away,& she visibly brightened at that idea

She says she is happy to go to halls for the first year,then maybe live at home for any remaining years (although I hope she makes friends & lives with them!)

I have said that there will be NO bringing home bags of washing every weekend

We have agreed to meet in town once a week for lunch..

 

So,as we have visited Reading already,& really liked it,it seems a solution may have been found.

Plus,Waitrose could probably transfer her to a branch nearer to the Uni.

 

Just got to work out what she is going to study now,as she is torn between English,Classics & Psychology

[The Dogmother]

Glad to hear it Sarah.

 

I worked all the time I was studying and actually came out in credit!

[Cinnamon]

Not much chance of that happening,I don't think

 

I actually think that the thought of the huge debt was another factor that was worrying her so much,so a local Uni should be part of the answer to that one

 

Its lucky that our local Uni is such a good one!

[Guest]

Usually people want to study something specific and then find a university that offers them the best facilities to undertake that particular course, so I find your daughter’s situation quite unusual.

 

If she isn't set on going to university then I probably wouldn't encourage her to go as not having a degree is by no means the end of highly paid career opportunities. On paper my job requires a degree (or equivalent), but I don't have a degree and I beat all the other candidates who did have degrees because I had the best overall qualifications, experience and personality for the job.

 

If she wants to do a specific career that requires a certain degree then that's different as she will be focused to achieve her goal. But if she wants to go to University but doesn't know what she wants to study then it seems to me that she is going for the wrong reasons, perhaps the status of a degree, or the lifestyle? Going to study for the wrong reasons is fine if that's what she wants, but bear in mind that it might not work as she may end up dropping out if she isn't 100% committed to a course and it's also a very expensive place to lead a social life! The problem with degrees is that if you can't make them work for you, they can start you off in a lifetime of debt with no guarantee of a good job at the end. There is no correct route for her to take, she just needs to pick a good route that's right for her at the time. Also nothing is forever and it's quite usual nowadays for people to change their careers down the line or attend university in adult life, so she will always have options open if she fancies a change. Just make sure she follows her own life and doesn't just attend uni because her mates are, you only live once so make sure you don't waste time on things you wouldn't or don't enjoy.

 

Other than university there are lots of options available to her depending on what she wants to do. If she just wants to take a year or 2 out then I would recommend something like repping on an 18-30's holiday - somewhere sunny! Or perhaps running a ski lodge over the winter. The pay isn't great but the lifestyle and people skills she will learn will be invaluable. Other than that there is the usual travelling/backpacking thing. There is nothing wrong with going straight into a job perhaps here or abroad. She could get paid apprenticeships at college where they pay you to learn and get qualified. Once she has a job she enjoys they will be willing to fund their staff's learning, so she could then build up a list of qualifications for free at degree level, whilst also benefiting from experience and a good salary at the same time.

 

Anyway I hope this mini essay helps and gives you and your daughter some ideas to think about...

 

xx

[Redwing]

Some good points there CC

 

I went to uni very half heartedly and dropped out after 6 weeks

 

I went straight in to work and the extra three years of experience I gained from working has meant I have never looked back - 15 years on I probably earn more than many of my highly educated schoolfriends and more than the average 33 year old graduate and better still I have no debts (apart from my crippling mortgage!!)

 

I think that uni is great if you have a vocation in mind and the degree is necessary or helps you acheive your goals but if you have no specific goal then I believe that experience is a better bet

[Lewis]

Glad you've got a bit of a solution

 

If she does go I'd def live in halls for the first year, even if its only 20 mins away, just so she experiences living independently and makes friends.

 

I don't have a job as such, just odd weeks at the farm and theatre work but have been saving and money does build up quickly - could pay for 1st year but obviously get tuition and maintenance loans and grants too

She has over a year until she goes to save up, and a 12 week holiday after exams next year to work full time to save up ... or travel

A load of my friends work in Waitrose and they said theres some sort of graduate transfer you can do when you go to Uni, and then still work at home in holidays. I know for popular places (like Sheffield) the list is 2 years long though!

[Cinnamon]

It is such a hard decision to make,isn't it?

And she is only 17,yet her tutors expect her to know exactly what she wants to do at uni & for a career.

 

Happily,the course that is looking most likely (English Literature & Classical Studies) should be welcomed by many employers as a well rounded degree rather than something more specific.

 

Sadly,if I leave her to make her own mind up & don't speak to her about it,she will bury her head in the sand & hope it all goes away.

She needs encouragement,& I think that once she has her mind set,she will work hard & be committed to her course. I will do all I can to help her choose whichever path she chooses.

 

Wanting to go for the social aspect is so not her.........she NEVER goes out

 

Lewis,if the worse comes to the worse,she can carry on working at Waitrose in Henley if she goes to Reading

And she will be going into halls for the first year if she does end up there,as I feel that is really important for her.

[bronze]

 

Secondly,her tutor said that if she took a year out it will be harder for her to get into Uni when she does decide to go.Furthermore,if she took a year out to work,it is not looked upon favourably against someone who has taken a year out to travel & broaden their minds.

 

 

 

I find this very odd. I would be much more likely to look favourably on someone who had worked hard so that they could go to university than I would someone who basically had a year long holiday. It shows commitment, dedication and maturity.

 

I wouldn't push her to go to university though as she doesn't know what she wants to do. It's a huge commitment and I think you have to be entirely dedicated to. Bear in mind some of the most successful people never went to uni.

[abwsco]

DD has four friends who both took over a year out to work and they've all got uni places. Only one of them had deferred their place. One of them has just finished their first year whereas the others have just finished their second years.

 

I know you've previously read my thread about DD deciding not to go to uni. She has just done her first full week of work and really looks as if a weight has been lifted off her shoulders even though there was no pressure from us for her to go, it was all from school.

 

I think times have changed so much that unless you need a degree for a vocation it's a waste of time going.

 

Infact thinking about it we (DD, DH or me) know of no-one with a degree who actually has a good job whether they're our age or friends children in their early 20's

[Guest]

Infact thinking about it we (DD, DH or me) know of no-one with a degree who actually has a good job whether they're our age or friends children in their early 20's

 

I can second that statistic!

[The Dogmother]

It depends really, in some areas it is very helpful if not essential. I know of 3 researchers, all of whom have a PhD in their job subject. My ex has a double first (from Edinburgh) and has a job using one of those subjects constantly.

 

I rarely use my fine art degree, but took it for the joy of studying the subject as i certainly never expected it to help me to get a job.

[Cinnamon]

I will be back on this subject in 3 years time no doubt.

The youngest has a very strong mind set about her career - journalism.

Unfortuntely for us,she wants to study in at Columbia,USA

[Egluntyne]

As many of you know, my youngest didn't have any desire to stay on at school, despite getting some very decent GCSEs - All A's, B's and a sprinkling of C's.

 

He has just finished a 4 year apprenticeship in plumbing, has no debt and earns considerably more than his older brother who is a trainee solicitor.