How Quickly Does Albendazole Work?

[BeckyBoo]

can anyone help me sort out bed time for my eldest girl She is 7, will be 8 at the end of February. She's always been a night owl, likes to stay up late and get up later! Which is kind of OK in the holidays but EVERY SINGLE SCHOOL NIGHT is a nightmare. She WILL NOT go to sleep before about 9.30pm and in between she will be up and down stairs with excuse after excuse, she's hungry, she's thirsty, she's not tired. I have tried everything - star charts, stories, letting her have a bit of quiet time either books or quiet play, tonight she asked if she could watch Mamma Mia (I hung out against them having TV's in their rooms for 2 years before finally being overridden by OH ) so I said yes but that it was going off wether it was finished or not with no arguments at 8.30 - which I think is STILL very late for a school night. She had a bedtime snack, a drink of milk, she had a 5 minute warning and we STILL had a paddy when it was time to turn it off. It's now after 9 and when I go up in a minute she will still be awake - I know this as she firstly got up to get a book after I confiscated the pesky Nintendo DS from under her covers, then she came down with the old "I'm hungry" thing again. I have tried bribery, punishment, I have sat her down and explained that I love spending all day with them, looking after them etc etc, but that the evenings are when I need a little time to myself, apart from tidying everything away (as I only really relax once the place is a "kid-free, toy-free zone") it's the only time ever I get to myself.

I have to say I am a night owl too, I manage best on about 6 hours sleep starting at about 1am, eldest daughter had no trouble seeing in the New Year with me, although she struggles to get up in the mornings and that leads to rows getting ready for school

I'm a bit at my wits end, so any ideas would be very gratefully considered.

 

Sorry, that was a lot longer than I expected but you know what it's like!

[Couperwife]

eeek, I dont know, I dont have any children.

 

but, what about taking the TV from her room and refusing the food, drinks, attention

 

everyone will be sat there going "what does she know, that will never work" - just a suggestion though.

 

good look, what ever you try to do

 

(((hugs)))

 

cathy

x

[Ygerna]

Oh the joys of children. I have three, my eldest is only 4 though so I cannot really speak out of experience. A united front from you and your OH is an absolute must though. Have you decided what time you want them to be in bed/asleep by between you? Also, have an agreed plan about what you will allow and what you wont. Then ruthlessly stick to it. It may take a few weeks because her sleep pattern is so ingrained now but remain consistant. I would also carry that over through holidays too. My SIL thinks I am a bit of a tyrant as I wont let my daughter stay up till all hours during the holidays. However, at the moment (only time will tell if it works long term) I can be reasonably sure that she will be asleep by about 8 at the latest, whereas they often have their daughter still up at 10pm

 

We got fed up with the 'I'm thirsty' routine, and we do allow DD to have a sports cap bottle with some water in it by her bed. As for the 'I'm hungry' we have always made it perfectly clear that there is nothing to eat after Supper. Dont eat supper, dont eat till breakfast. We have never given in on this either. Crickey I sound a right old witch

 

Sometimes my DD will say that she can't sleep because her 'eyes are not tired' I have a small tin of Badger 'night night' balm, I tell her the fairies make it specially for when little children cannot sleep, not sure that would work with an 8 yr old, however, it contains lavendar and is quite soothing.

 

 

At the moment, from your post it sounds as if you are caught in a bit of a circle. I hope others can offer some advice too, the more options you have the more chance you have of finding somethng that works for you.

[Snowy]

Oooh, Mrs B, I do feel for you I can't really give any advice - I have always had a fairly strict routine for mine, the old drink, bath, bed at 7pm sharp and don't dare set foot outside the bedroom after that. Middle son does sometimes look at a book once in bed, but rarely for more than a few minutes before he's unconscious But I think I'm just fortunate that mine are definitely not night owls but do like to be up with the lark, so the routine works well. Whereas I am also a night owl - I remember my mum having the same problem with me, I used to read under the bedcovers until 2 or 3 am on a regular basis. But I didn't dare not get out of bed in the morning!

 

I think I would be tempted to try some drastic measures like removing the TV, and maybe allowing her to be late for school once or twice if you can manage it. Whatever you try, good luck - kids eh, they'd try the patience of a saint!

 

Just read Ygerna's post as well - good idea about the food and drink. Anticipate all eventualities and stick to them! I agree with the holiday bedtimes as well - mine only get to stay up an hour later in the hols

[Guest]

Like others I havn't had this problem, James is out like a light just after 7pm and even last night when he was jet lagged he just got into bed with me and laid there silently whilst I waded through half a dozen episodes of Eastenders (I had jet lag too!). He stayed up to celebrate the New Year - but we celebrated it on UK time so it was only 7pm where we were - then he went to bed!!!

 

It sounds like you need to set clear boundaries and stick to them. Allow her a drink and to have room based activities but NOT to come out of her room. On the odd occasions James tries the hungry/thirsty thing he gets given a chunk of bread or glass of water - IN HIS ROOM. I do NOT let him come out of there as these are clearly diversionary tactics. I wouldnt let him have a telly but as your girl is a night owl it could be a good idea to let her watch hers but keeping the "stay in your room" rule at all times. She may even get bored with it all eventually and just start to sleep, sounds like she wants attention as much as anything else, that should be the one thing she does not get. You give her a lot of attention and deserve your "me" time - its people who don't have that who end up in all sorts of bother.

[Tina C]

Hi Mrs B - I too have a 7 yr old, but she is an only child and much easier to 'control'

 

But I am a very harsh parent - I don't believe in TVs in bedrooms - we don't have one and L does not either.

 

So what I would do is take away the TV, and any gadgets, then tell her she can stay up as long as she likes as long as she stays in her room. BUT she must set her alarm for 7 (or whatever time she needs to be up) AND she must get up then.

 

It does seem like she is looking for individual attention though so maybe you need to find a way of giving her that once or twice a week (I know its difficult with your shifts and having more than one child etc). Maybe plan something as a reward if she sticks to certain rules?

 

OK so I am a bit like Couperwife - having just the one doesn't make me an expert parent

 

Hope you manage to sort it out - you defintiely need that 'me' time.

[Yorkshire Pudding]

I have a seven-year-old too - we have a routine that is non-negotiable and it only gets varied on VERY special occasions. Poor you, bedtime is when I am least likely to be able to handle an argument with a determined child, as mine know to their cost .

 

A friend had dreadful trouble with her children - she had never sleep-trained them and had got into the habit of going into their rooms every time they made a noise. Consequently they were up eight to ten times every night, and so was she. After seven years of sleep deprivation, she finally cracked it by having a very loud conversation with me, in earshot of her three-year-old, about how big boys don't get up in the night, how their bedroom doors stay shut, and no-one will be coming to check on them in the night because everyone will be asleep. Then she had to steel herself and stick to that last bit.... it worked, he slept through for the first time that night and quickly got out of the habit of waking.

 

I would establish a strict routine, starting with a conversation about what is going to happen. A united front with your OH is essential. I would also remove TV, Nintendo DS etc. until she has got into the habit of going to bed - and explain that she will be allowed them back once the arguments have stopped and she is going to bed and getting up when she should.

[kez]

Mrs Bertie, I thought you were talking about my 9 year old

 

She's currently reading a book in bed, sure she'll be down again in a minute.

 

I have tried so many different things and nothing works.

 

Luckily my 6 year old is the total opposite. She usually asks to go to bed about 7 pm, then falls straight to sleep. Although she does talk half the night in her sleep

[BeckyBoo]

Mrs Bertie, I thought you were talking about my 9 year old

 

She's currently reading a book in bed, sure she'll be down again in a minute.

 

I have tried so many different things and nothing works.

 

Luckily my 6 year old is the total opposite. She usually asks to go to bed about 7 pm, then falls straight to sleep. Although she does talk half the night in her sleep

 

I think you have my children! My 6 year old goes to bed when I tell her, minimal protest AND she talks all night long in her sleep! I had to get up at about 3ish the other morning as I could hear her shouting "Mum, Mum", went in there and she was fast asleep!

 

Thanks for all the advice, I'll have a proper talk with her tomorrow after school, I never wanted her or the others to have a TV in their room, I don't have one in the bedroom, TV is a "sometime" distraction for me, but Georgia is a film fan and a night owl. It's got to stop though, you're all right - and having none or one makes you as much as an expert as me - I'm still making it up as I go along!

 

As always, thanks guys!

[xScrunchee]

Hi Mrs B,

 

My daughter is 9 years old and just like yours-could happily spend all night awake

 

She does have a TV in her room and she goes to bed at 8.30 every night.

We have tried many things to get her to fall asleep early but whatever we do-she is still up untill 10-11pm.

 

Since my Dad passed away the May before last, Em had big problems going to bed as she would lay there thinking and get herself upset and worried so now we have a deal which seems to be working ok.

 

She has a couple of cookies about 8pm. 8.30 she has a drink of milk and uses the loo etc. She then goes to bed and watches Bid TV or price drop TV.

No films or programmes-just shopping channels, I know that the content is safe for her and it does keep her mind off of worrying about every little thing. She is also allowed to read but she does pretty much stay in her room.

I get her up around 7-7.30am every day.

 

I don't need much sleep myself-about 6-6 1/2 hours is good for me so I cannot really assume that my daughter needs a set amount of sleep. She goes to bed at the same time each night and gets up at the same time each day so whatever time she actually drops off to sleep is fine, she must be getting the hours she needs.

We are all different so people may not agree with how I do things but it works for us. You just need to find what works for you's

 

Good luck and try not to get too stressed as they grow up so fast-this is only a temporary problem, it won't last forever as they are not children forever

[Snowy]

Good luck and try not to get too stressed as they grow up so fast-this is only a temporary problem, it won't last forever as they are not children forever

 

Wise words Jay, it's easy to forget that bit sometimes isn't it?

 

Nice to see you back by the way! xx

[Chook n Boo Mum]

Hi Mrs B, we could all "preach" our own gospel of bedtime/childrearing in general & what works for us won't work for others ( I just have to listen to my neighbours nightmares at bedtime ), hence the "make-it-up-as-you-go-along" feelings towards childrearing we all harbour!! I am quite strict and my sister has a much more "laissez faire" attitude to bedtimes which she had to redress when my nephew went to school (he's now 6 1/2). When he started school she was still cuddling him to sleep, when he was tired not at a given time, with a bottle/cup of milk in the front room with everyone else sitting around , child fought it every night, no routine at all; she even denied ever hearing/being told the bath/bottle/bed routine which millions of us - including me, her supposedly close sister - use successfully!

 

Our system works like this: no gadgets in bedroom except a cd player to play "soothing" (for that read "boring" as far as the High School Musical era kids would think ) classical music, strict bedtime and get-up time and a milky drink with a simple biscuit or bread & butter snack (nothing exciting though, apparently a lettuce sandwich has soporific powers....!) just prior to set bedtime, DD takes her milk to bed with her in an Anywayup cup still & usually doesn't have the snack, that's just DS if necessary. When they were tiny we used the tea/bath/drink/bed routine at a fairly leisurely pace, but rarely deviated from the path, and it worked, and has stood us in good stead, it still works if instigated today. I used to be able to set the routine in motion from about 4.30 if needed & get the little darlings into bed by 6.30, now they can read a clock that doesn't happen unless they are dead on their feet & asking for a nap, which happens about as often as hens teeth are found !

 

The fact that she has trouble getting up in the morning suggests that she needs more sleep than she's getting, so the problem needs to be redressed by earlier bedtime. At 7/8 my DD was old enough to reason with...DS however was another matter ! I threatened to take my children to school in PJs if they didn't get up in time to get dressed & fed in the mornings - the threat has never had to be followed through but hangs in the air if needed!

 

I think the key is consistency and although the next week or so if you choose to start a strict routine will be hard, but should in theory get easier as time goes on, and OH needs to be in on the plan & not deviate when you are on a shift where you can't oversee the routine is adhered to, DD will know if he is the weak link & work on it, children are clever like that aren't they . My DH has worked out that "if Mummy says..." is a very good way of getting himself absolved from all responsibility in a difficult situation following several ear-bashings from me. Maybe sit her down & sort out a routine & write it down, so it's clear to everyone; DD, Daddy, Grandma, babysitter, dog & chickens

 

I've never had to go the "shut the door & do not let the little banshee escape" route thankfully & I feel that is a bit extreme, but if it works for some who am I to query

 

Hope this rather long-winded waffle helps in some small way... Good luck, it's for her good ultimately as well as your sanity, just keep that in mind like a mantra when the going gets tough & follow the path you have set.

 

Sha x

[..lay a little egg for me]

My DS (nearly 10) is another night owl and does the same old routine of "I'm hungry", "I'm thirsty", "I'm not tired", "I'm too hot", "Can you refill my hot-water bottle", "I just need to tell you something" etc etc. Like others, I am pretty strict about giving in to these excuses, no food (but a drink of water in his room is allowed), other requests being met with a repeated "Goodnight". He has no TV in his room but is allowed to read for a short time. I have given up trying to get him to sleep before 9 pm, but if he goes to bed at 8.30 I read to him for a bit, which he loves as he is getting my full attention; he knows he is not allowed stories if he goes to bed later.

 

I think you can't stop them from being night owls but you can try to bring the bedtime early enough that they don't have too much trouble getting up for school. By my reckoning DS gets about 9-10 hours sleep a night. At weekends he can sleep in an extra hour on saturdays and as long as he likes on sundays so I hope he catches up then. I worked out from his natural sleep patterns as observed during the holidays that he only needs 10 hours a night, so I think we have reached a workable compromise regarding bedtime.

 

So, my advice, for what its worth is to find some kind of bribe that will get her into bed at a suitable time, perhaps something that means she gets your attention plus she has time to report her thirst, too hot, too cold etc so that can be dealt with and future complaints safely ignored. Once she is in bed, maybe allowed to read a short while and then a firm lights out time. As for the suitable time, that has to be a compromise between the time she feels ready for bed (if like my son that is never) and when you think she ought to be in bed! If you can work out how long her body actually needs and work back from what time she has to get up, then at least you will have a good argument for your chosen time (not that it will cut much ice with her if she is like my DS!).

 

Good luck

[The Dogmother]

I agree with Tina and the others on this... we only have one tiny TV in the house and it's never on, we don't have DSes either. Rosie loves to read, but she knows that unless she goes to bed on time, that she is grumpy when wake her at 6.30am to get up for school.

 

I'd get rid of all the distractions and have a bit of quiet bonding time before sleep and try to break her out of the habit of all the distractions. It doesn't take long to re-set their body clocks.

 

Rosie was a dreadful sleeper as a baby and for her first three years; I was going to work on a maximum of 4 hours sleep per night for the first three years. Once she was old enough to reason with, it got better.

 

Good luck Mrs B

[chickencam]

My 2 girls both sleep very little they are like my OH whereas DS and myself could sleep for England. Everyone is different.

 

A regular routine does help and once she is back in the school routine she will be more tired and will hopefully sleep better.

[Tessa the Duchess]

Oh dear Mrs B 'me' time is so important, sorry you are having this problem My children are now old enough to be having sleep problems with their own children, although I never had any problems when they were little. I too was very strict and kept a routine supper,bath,bed story. When they were the age of your daughter the only thing I allowed were story tapes on one of those Fisher Price tape recorders, I would never allow a tv in a young childs' bedroom, but each to his own. Hope you find a way of sorting this and that peace is restored.

 

Tessa

[alih]

Mrs B I always hesitate to add to these threads because i hate the idea of "telling "others what I think they should do and because there's loads of sensible advice already but here goes for what it's worth.

I have 4 kids from 5-14. They all do and always have gone to bed "MUCH earlier" than their mates. I have a very strict routine even with the older ones who are in bed by 10 on a school night and NOT allowed to have sleepovers where they stay up all night as seems to be the trend. I tell them all that we need grown-up time.

 

What is most important to you? our rule is that once in bed they do NOT leave their rooms unles to go to the loo or if they are ill. I'm afraid they are not allowed gadgets in their rooms either - my teens have stopped trying to protest about tvs and screens in their rooms as they know it will get them nowhere - and I would agree that taking the DS and telly away are probably a good start.

 

If she wants to read and you know she doesn't need food or drink I suggest you choose one rule and implement that rather than lots of changes at once eg. stay in your room once you are there unless you are ill. If she stays up reading under the covers but is quiet and gets up for school that may not be such a big problem as you having some child-free time?

 

Hope it gets sorted soon

[The Dogmother]

Very sensible advice Ali

[Clur]

The one thing that worked for me and my soon-to-be 7 and 4 year olds is not to respond to the one hundred requests and stalling tactics they deploy at bedtime. They do still try it on the odd occasion, but I just bark 'bed' and tuck them in and kiss goodnight - nothing more. Depriving them of any conversation (even if it's a telling off) has worked wonders, and means by 7.30/8pm we have our own space.

[craftyhunnypie]

When we were children we were put to put with a glass & small jug of cordial in our rooms. Sometimes a small plate of bisuits. So that we could help ourselves if we were thirsty in the night. Very often, the biscuits didn't get eaten - but it was the thought that they were there. We used to fall asleep reading, or with our walkman headphones on.

As we got a bit older mum & dad made sure we went to bed on a milky drink...horlicks or hot chocolate.

Have you tried the Horlicks Snoozoo? Sends me to sleep even now! Is she afraid or anxious when she goes to bed maybe?

Aromatherapy oils on the pillow or some sort of comforter for her. If not a teddy, then one of those teddy things that have wheat in them - that you warm.

As I don't have children, I don't know what to suggest.

But as a nanny - all the children used to go to bed pretty good. If there were problems then stories, singing to them always worked. If not they were allowed to play in their rooms on the understanding that they would then have to put themselves to bed & to sleep without a kiss or seeing me - who they loved. So they nearly always went bed when I said, stayed there until I kissed them goodnight. Most of the time they had already dropped off.

I wish you much luck.

Emma.x

[Janty]

My son is twelve, nearly thirteen and he never sleeps. He does have gadgets in his room but we have a strict rule of no PS2, PSP or watching TV on a school night. The consequence of breaking this rule is that he looses the priviledge of having them for the following weekend. I have only had to enforce this once.

 

However, I know that my son is a different entity to most children as he has Aspergers and ADHD. One Saturday, he turned up at our bedroom door at five o'clock in the morning with his PS2 all disconnected. When I asked what he was doing, he said that he needed to put it in our room as he had broken the rules on Thursday night and played PS2. He was enforcing the consequence himself.

[Joojoo]

However, I know that my son is a different entity to most children as he has Aspergers and ADHD. One Saturday, he turned up at our bedroom door at five o'clock in the morning with his PS2 all disconnected. When I asked what he was doing, he said that he needed to put it in our room as he had broken the rules on Thursday night and played PS2. He was enforcing the consequence himself.

 

Ah bless him (I hope that doesn't sound patronising as it's not meant to )

[The Dogmother]

Brilliant Janty - 'self-policing teenager'

 

That lad will go far with a conscience like that.

[KAZAROO]

How about Valerian from Holland and Barret.. tried and tested by this insomniac.....

[cam1]

Oh i have to say my 2 are a nightmare as well with all of the problems , delaying tactics you've mentioned! My 8 yr ds and 3 y dd share a room and egg each oher on. They do (unfortunately) have a tv in ther from when my 16 yr old stepson used to have that room, the shared with my ds and well its stuck! All i hope is they grow out of it

Cam

mya

velma