Redwing Posted August 6, 2009 Share Posted August 6, 2009 I get plenty of wooden coop owners and I DON'T tell them that I think they are messy, high maintenance pieces of tat. Especially the super cheap home made ones. keep your dignity and stay polite back. Steady on Pengy! thats not a very polite thing to say, some of us are proud of our home-made and wooden coops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdcambs Posted August 6, 2009 Author Share Posted August 6, 2009 We are mainly green minded people who have developed an interest in nature and self sufficiency on some small scale. I'm somewhat surprised that self proclaimed "green minded" individuals would chose petrochemical derived products, when their are perfectly viable, and cheaper, more environmentally friendly alternatives! Perhaps someone would expand on that rational? I'm sorry but you make no sense at all. Wood is NOT environmentally friendly, little comes from sustainable sources, much energy and petrochemicals are used in the manufacture and procurement of the product and as I already stated - they may be cheaper initially but they do not hold their value as well and need a LOT more maintenance which some of us are rather pants at. Just looking at our garden this year - the pergola badly needs painting as does the summerhouse and the 2 story childs house. Eglu needs a hose down. The last I'll manage the rest wil involve using chemical based paints and paying a handyman to come and do it. The alternatives are viable but so is using public transport to get to work - viable but takes an hour and a half, involves 3 bus changes and takes me around 25 miles to do a 4 mile journey. Well, I've heard it all now, plastic is more environmentally friendly than wood, and I make no sense at all! FYI, hives made from ceder require no paint or preservatives, last decades, and have no greater a distrabution and manufacturing carbon footprint than plastic ones (far far less I suspect) and cost a fraction of a beehaus. As for your bus travel analogy, I'm sorry but don't understand what point you are trying to make! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christian Posted August 6, 2009 Share Posted August 6, 2009 Right, enough now! Can we please get back to the point of this thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 6, 2009 Share Posted August 6, 2009 I get plenty of wooden coop owners and I DON'T tell them that I think they are messy, high maintenance pieces of tat. Especially the super cheap home made ones. keep your dignity and stay polite back. Steady on Pengy! thats not a very polite thing to say, some of us are proud of our home-made and wooden coops. Sorry Redwing - I said I think that! I think a lot of things that others disagree with - don't get me starting on camping, caravanning or cycling - millions of people ARE wrong about ALL of those things and myself and Jeremy Clarkson are right! My friend and I have been having such a conversation on FB - she has been on holiday in a YURT on Bodmin moor - her idea of heaven. I've been on an ocean liner with a butler to serve in my stateroom and 5* formal dinners - my idea of heaven. As I said I don't TELL anyone who comes to a hen party to learn about chook keeping that I don't like the idea of wooden coops - which I feel are NO MORE environmentally friendly than my robust, long lasting Eglu. PD - the bus is as viable as is a wooden coop. Saw one for sale earlier - £185 and no fox proofing with a run less than half the size of an Eglu. Didn't fancy trying to clean it much either. Regarding bee hives. I still have no idea which I will get - after I've done a course and feel ready to start - I thought the Beehaus was going to be pricey but seeing the size of it maybe not so much. However all these people taking it up as a "hobby" without proper research will give a handy influx of second hand hives of all sorts although with the kind of diseases mentioned maybe they will not be such a good idea. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chickenanne Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 I have a wooden coop, and it's fab. It's big, easy to clean, attractive to look at, robust, fox proof, and has a big run. I know not all wooden coops are. But to insult wooden coops and the people who use them is unfair - look at how offended people are when the eglu/cube is criticised. I could afford to swap mine for a cube or an eglu if I wanted to, but I don't; it suits me and the chickadiddles and I prefer it. Horses for courses and all that. I have wooden hives, which I acquired from an elderly local beek. All of his gear was from 1930-1950, and the only maintenance it needs is for the roof to be re-felted every 10 years or so (becuase roofing felt doesn't have an indenfinite life). I bought a mesh floor for it as varroa is, in the grand scheme of things, a relatively new problem. Admittedly, they aren't particularly pretty, but I don't want them to be eye-catching as they are deliberately kept out-of-sight. But that is besides the point - if Beehauses, eglu's and cubes are used for 20 years or more then their pollutant footprint over their lifespan is going to be pretty good, in the same way as well-made cedar wooden items. Cheap, short-term things that aren't made to last and aren't looked after well are much more damaging over their lifespan becuase their lifespan is just so short. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bronze Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 #I think Pengy was saying that she doesnt go around saying that to the people at her hen parties so please don't start bashing her choices either which.... is what was happening. Noone knows enough about this knew hive yet. I'm interested purely in a nosy way as I have no desire for bees or rather not yet , gardens too small with four kids a dog and chickens. but... It's all very well promoting beekeeping to affluent chicken fanciers, who might be willing to pay a premium for an untried product (bees are not chickens) but beekeeping associations are not going to thank you for an influx of new beginners who are also likely to be buying in foreign bees to put in their new hives, at a time when beginners courses are already struggling to keep up with demand. Is just plain rude. Its assuming that people who buy omlet products have more money than sense. Most of us are ordinary hardworking, often fairly broke people who save or sell things to raise enough money for something they want. Much as someone else might do for a new stereo. Why on earth are omleteers any more likely to buy foreign bees in than any other new beekeeper. The majority of them have to think a lot before they buy a slightly dearer product so often do more research not less. Thank goodness theres a swear filter on this forum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jules. Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 Bron that's exactly why I do my hen parties- to pay for my new eglu & Omlet addiction In response to the post about Omleteers being able to splash their cash around freely, what with having a mortgage, a family car to run & two young children we're not exactly rolling in it here at my house, but I did do lots of research into hen houses & then decided that the eglu was for me & my lifestyle, even if it was slightly more expensive than other types of hen housing. in the long run my original second hand made me a handsome profit when sold the following year when I upgraded to a Omlet do a cracking PR & marketing spiel, which tells it like it is & highlights the benefits of their products as do all other limited companies that I know of. Products stand or fall on their durability & ease of use, & for what I've seen so far of the Beehaus it's a winner. However, time will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 From the years I have spent on the Omlet forum, I think that most Omleteers who are moving into bee-keeping would buy British first and foremost - it's a pattern that emeregs within this group - we always prefer to buy British/local wherever possible. I can see that it is easy to diss a new group, who suddenly burst onto the scene, all keen and eager. But why not harness all that energy and enthusiasm, add some of your extensive knowledge and turn it into a very positive and beneficial relationship? May I suggest that both parties here draw a line under previous correpondence and start afresh in that vein? I'd love to keep bees, but my friend Prudence is reminding me that I have too little land, time and money. One day perhaps though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdcambs Posted August 7, 2009 Author Share Posted August 7, 2009 Why on earth are omleteers any more likely to buy foreign bees in than any other new beekeeper. A good question Bronze. Traditionally those wanting to learn beekeeping usually join an association, attend a beginners class during the winter and go to practical apiary sessions in the spring long before they get a hive or bees. Then the association will likely provide bees for them (often at no charge) and sometimes a mentor to help them when they need it. Those bees are either swarms or nucs taken from local hives and only very rarely will queens be bought in to head up those nucs (at least this is my experience) Some associations even run try-a-hive schemes where they give you a flat pack hive, help you build it and in the following autumn offer you the choice to pay for it at a very competitive price or return it if you've decided beekeeping is not for you (something you are not going to know in the 30 days return policy Omlet offer) Very few people raise and sell bees commercially in this country, unlike America, but many of the few that do import queens because that is easier for them to guarantee a supply of them than British raised queens. So, if you are buying your Beehaus because you're convinced by Omlets advertising that all you need is their hive, booklet and some bees from one of their suppliers (who have yet to be identified) don't be surprised if some beekeepers (and possibly associations) are less than enthusiastic about the prospect. It will be us, not Omlet, who will be called out to deal with preventable swarms, any nasty colonies that beginners are too afraid to deal with, and suffer any spread of diseases or parasites that go unidentified by Omlet customers. I know you may feel I'm being negative, and I happily concede that not all Omlet customers are going to justify my concerns, but I hope you will appreciate the position I'm coming from. I find it hard to see Omlet as a champion of the bees and an environmentally concerned company, when their primary concern is the sale of plastic hives that are made in Iowa and shipped to the UK, when there are more environmentally friendly and cheaper options that are arguably more suitable for the purpose manufactured here in the UK. Best regards Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jules. Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 Could you pleasev tell me where is your info that the hives are made in Iowa? Eglus & cubes are made in the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdcambs Posted August 7, 2009 Author Share Posted August 7, 2009 Could you pleasev tell me where is your info that the hives are made in Iowa? Eglus & cubes are made in the UK. Hmmm, Ill have to go look up where I read that on the net (if I can find it) but I'm quite happy to be corrected if that is not the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egluntyne Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 I'd be interested to hear more about this too. Whilst I'm remaining completely open minded about the type of hive I will opt for......if indeed I do decide to keep bees, after attending the appropriate courses etc......this would have an impact on my final decision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdcambs Posted August 7, 2009 Author Share Posted August 7, 2009 http://www.omlet.us/files/public/US_brochure_Chickens.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christian Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 The eglu, cube and beehaus are all made in Worcestershire. The US eglus are made in the US, according to your above link pdcambs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdcambs Posted August 7, 2009 Author Share Posted August 7, 2009 My bet would be that eglu parts are manufactured in somewhere like china, shipped to the UK or America and then "assembled". Of course I'm just guessing and welcome being corrected as I said. I still don't understand how anyone can think this as more environmentally friendly than wood (even if the wood is imported) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bronze Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 Not feeling at all patronised This is one of the sites that has been recommended in the past. http://www.fragile-planet.co.uk/?gclid=CKHgwp-tkZwCFdYB4wodumJvew I don't see how that set up is any different to omlets. Oh except its not plastic. The whole idea is the same though. You will get people either way who do research properly and those who don't. The only difference in fact is that omlet also have a forum where you can ask questions and that company don't. I'm not criticizing that company as I'm sure their product is very good just that its no better than the beehaus (that we know of so far) I still don't understand why you think people who buy from omlet are less responsible people than people who buy elsewhere. Read around the forum. There was talk of bees before news of the beehaus and plenty of people asking for advice and finding out about their local associations. Now for Clarets blood pressure I'm going to (try &) leave it there. I don't think we're going to go anywhere as you seem to have made your judgement already. I'm going to wait for the facts/proof. Anyone whos already got bees on here thinking about one? (after they've seen what its like of course) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bronze Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 My bet would be that eglu parts are manufactured in somewhere like china, shipped to the UK or America and then "assembled". Of course I'm just guessing and welcome being corrected as I said. I still don't understand how anyone can think this as more environmentally friendly than wood (even if the wood is imported) How about not guessing again and finding out facts. I'm pretty sure some people on here know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egluntyne Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 My bet would be that eglu parts are manufactured in somewhere like china, shipped to the UK or America and then "assembled". Of course I'm just guessing and welcome being corrected as I said. I still don't understand how anyone can think this as more environmentally friendly than wood (even if the wood is imported) As you say....it is a bet and not based on fact. If you could provide the facts, I'm sure we would be interested to hear them. You have made your position clear about the environmental issues. Please allow others to have their own opinions about this, and even if they disagree with you, respect their viewpoint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Christian Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 ALL parts are made in the UK and assembled in Worchester. The bee suits are imported from Europe. Back on topic please...... Many experienced beeks have already ordered the beehaus according to Omlet HQ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chickenanne Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 I don't know enough about where cedar is sourced or about how Beehaus is manufactured to comment on how much pollution each process causes. As I said before, any small-sized product which lasts and is used for 20 or 30 or more years will have a relatively low environmental impact over the course of it's lifetime. We should be focussing on cheap disposable junk as enviromentally unsound, not hives/coops/etc which can last for several decades (I would hope!) be they made of plastic or wood. I agree that it doesn't matter where you get a hive from, what matters is that people choose one which best suits their needs, and of course, that they have carefully weighed up what those needs are first. IMHO what Omlet do that other companies don't to the same extent is to have very strong marketing and PR. And I do think that in a way this has made people twitchy: a lot of the media reports seem to suggest that bees should not be kept by just anyone in any situation, on a whim. Understandably the Omlet marketing focusses only on the positives (as tehy should! they are a business after all!), but coupled with the recent, slightly naive media reporting it does raise issues as to how far people believe bees are easy and trouble free, before they get them! I think everyone here is really agreeing that bees should be kept after good solid learning, by people who have handled them before (e.g through local assoc) ideally with local support, and with every consideration given the the impact on other people living/working around about. So why are we so keen to ahve this ill-feeling? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
legend21 Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 Hello all, I am saving to buy my beehaus, so looking forward to hearing more on this forum Jackie No bees Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 oh good for you let us know how it all unfolds and how you get on a very interesting topic going on here..what colour are you going for then?? Red again to match the cube?? indie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bronze Posted August 7, 2009 Share Posted August 7, 2009 I would say it being announced on the news that they want more people to keep bees would have more o an impact than omlet will Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdcambs Posted August 7, 2009 Author Share Posted August 7, 2009 I would say it being announced on the news that they want more people to keep bees would have more o an impact than omlet will Have they said on the news that.... buy this hive as "it makes beekeeping straightforward and fun."? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pdcambs Posted August 7, 2009 Author Share Posted August 7, 2009 Hello all, I am saving to buy my beehaus, so looking forward to hearing more on this forum Jackie No bees Hi Jackie From your signature "No bees" I gather you are not already a beekeeper Have you ever seen inside a beehive? or is it your impression that with a beehaus, keeping bees will be relativly simple and all you will need is the booklet it comes with? Best regards Peter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
