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[Chickendoodle]

My YD (aged 22) has just started a relationship with a really lovely guy. He is a devout Christian and she is not so they thought very carefully before embarking on the relationship.

 

His Mother seems very anti her and this is apparently because her son was very badly let down by a previous girlfriend who broke his heart. She was also not a Christian and she made her son promise that his next girlfriend would be a Christian and would also be over 25 (my YD fails on both of these counts although she is a good kind girl - christian with a small c rather than a large one) I told my YD just to give it time and his Mother would start to judge her on her her personality and actions rather than her beliefs.

 

I don't think this is the place to start a discussion on religion as I am aware what a minefield it is but I would be interested to know if any of you out there have had similar issues and whether ultimately you made the relationship work or the issues were just too big to get over. I have read about various multi faith marriages so there must be some success stories out there.

 

At least my YD and her BF are aware of the potential problems and are talking about them very openly. My YD would in no way try to change him or stop him going to church - equally she is unwilling to go to church with him as she thinks it would be hypocritical.

 

I do hope that the thread can centre on the relationship rather than religion as such. I don't see the potential problems as anything different from multi-cultural or any other sort of "different" relationship.

 

My DH is 13 years older than me which is also "different" but we have been married for 20 years so it must be working.

Edited August 4, 2010 by Guest

[Busybird]

You describe your YD's BF as a devout Christian - presumably that means that his religion is central to the way he lives his life and is very important to him. In the early days of any relationship it is easy to gloss over perceived faults and differences but these can become chasms in a relationship if differences are fundamental. I would worry that he would try to change your YD and that she may resent his wish to change her.

 

It may be that YD and BF can live with their differences but issues with extended families can cause major problems in any relationship. BF's mother may just be worried about her son because he was hurt badly before. However, if she is also 'devout' then she too may want to change your YD. Many MIL's seem to consider their child's partner unworthy of their child's devotion but religious beliefs can be particularly entrenched - especially as so many religions encourage followers to go out and convert the unbelievers.

 

After all that negative comment they are young and happy at the moment so should, perhaps, just be allowed to enjoy that. So long as your YD is aware of the potential issues she can make informed decisions and set down ground rules in the relationship as things develop.

[Cinnamon]

I don't have any personal experience,although my SIL was of no specific religion & she married into a very devout Catholic family,converting her religion along the way.

 

What strikes me from your post is that the mother sounds a bit controlling.

Personally I would have no problem who my girls saw,whatever their religion or anything else,so long as they were happy. I am sure you yourself feel the same way.

 

Your daughter sounds level headed,mature & lovely & I hope that the mother of her boyfriend can soon see these qualities in her & welcome her into the family on that basis,rather than what religion she is

 

Our differences should be celebrated

[Lavenders_Blue]

I am from a Christian family and also a Christian myself. From my experiences (which may be different to others) there can be pressure on a non-Christian boyfriend or girlfriend to start coming to church and become a Christian. Your daughter may want to think about how she would feel were this to happen, as if her boyfriend or his family start encouraging her to attend church and she does not want to, this could potentially cause tension between her and her boyfriend and him and his family.

 

I don't mean this to sound negative towards either Christians or your daughter's boyfriends family - but I can be a bit clunky with words sometimes so if this comes across as negative then my apologies!

[Happy chickens!]

Two good friends of mine are in this position and have been married for a number of years. They are however much older (mid 50s, second marriages) so don't have to answer to their parents.

 

He goes to church every sunday and takes part in various church activities, she plays tennis. They each attend some of the others interests on a social basis, eg he comes down for a meal after a match, she goes to fundraising events to support him. In this way they each have some space to enjoy their interests, but come together to make a succesful marriage.

 

I think the point about being a christian with a small c is important - if she was totally against religion I would see trouble ahead, but if both are willing to compromise and respect each other's beliefs, then anything is possible.

[The Dogmother]

..... Our differences should be celebrated

 

I couldn't agree more.

 

I hope that your daughter's BF's Mum waits to get to know her before making any judgements. It sounds as if the chap is in his mid-twenties, so surely able to make any choices for himself.

 

I come from a devout Italian Roman Catholic family, but have no conventional religious beliefs myself and Rosie hasn't bene baptised. If anything, we lean towards pagan celebrations as they fit in more with our values and lifestyle. Most of my family are pretty pretty respectful of our differences and I rarely get any lectures.

[PurpleTree]

Two good friends of mine are in this position and have been married for a number of years. They are however much older (mid 50s, second marriages) so don't have to answer to their parents.

 

He goes to church every sunday and takes part in various church activities, she plays tennis. They each attend some of the others interests on a social basis, eg he comes down for a meal after a match, she goes to fundraising events to support him. In this way they each have some space to enjoy their interests, but come together to make a succesful marriage.

 

I think the point about being a christian with a small c is important - if she was totally against religion I would see trouble ahead, but if both are willing to compromise and respect each other's beliefs, then anything is possible.

 

 

That sounds similar to my parents, although we're all Christian (Church in Wales) my mum has never been particularly keen on going to Church, whereas my dad goes every Sunday, is Church Warden and tower captain of the bellringers. My mum is quite happy to support social events and she does quite often go to 'special' services (eg Easter, Christmas etc). I go to Church when I fancy it, probably every few weeks - I enjoy my lie in on a Sunday too much and hubby will come with me, with the children, on special Sundays.

 

I think maybe if your daughter wants to persue the relationship, she may have to show willing, perhaps attend the social events if she's not keen on attending church. I can only foresee problems if they ever want to get married, presumably he'd want a Church service, whereas maybe she wouldn't? Same if they ever have children, may be a conflict in the way they're brought up? Probably too soon to be thinking about those things

[A chickychickychick-ENN!!]

Sounds to me like there are two issues - the church and the mother, and both need to be dealt with separately.

 

It's extremely hard to win over a disapproving mother, so she'll have fun with that one!

 

As for the religion side, I'd say it depends on the type of church. In the more fanatical/active/hardcore wings of the evangelical and charismatic churches, there is often real disapproval of dating a heathen and huge pressure for them to join the club. There is a huge amount of room for long-term emotional blackmail from the believers - not because they mean to be horrible at all, but because they love god so much that the idea of the person they love the most being damned to hell by the god they love so much creates huge anxiety and conflict for them and is an unbearable thought for them.

 

If one partner is very ingrained in a church culture and the other is a believer but not as involved in church life, bizarrely (to non-believers), exactly the same issues can crop up. Pressure from the church can convince the more religiously active member of the couple that the other partner is 'not christian enough' and the situation ends up the same as it is between a heathen and a believer.

 

It depends on how much belief and church culture the couple have in common.

 

It's good they're talking, but if one of them is seriously into god and church culture and the other not so much, it may be very difficult.

 

I only know one couple for whom it worked in the long-term, but even then they have glaring elephants in the room - for example he is a scientist, but she believes unflinchingly in religion-based young earth creationism. Also, she got more religious as their relationship went on over the years. They didn't start out AS different as they are now.

 

I also know a pair of heathens who converted to being born agains within their relationship, but twenty years apart, so there was a long period in the middle where they were very, very different and things were very strained on the faith side and he was constantly (gently) told he would be going to hell until he converted.

 

On the plus side, given the ages of your daughter and her beau, they're so young. I'd say let them work it out for themselves and enjoy each other's company. It will go where it goes, and they'll learn and grow from it. If it works, fabulous, and if it doesn't, if they continue to talk and communicate effectively, they'll have learnt a lot from each other and may be able to continue a valuable friendship without recrimination. There's nothing so lovely as young love. Let them enjoy it and work out the aspects of their relationship which matter the most to them without worrying too much.

[Alis girls]

I have several friends who attend church and would call themselves Christian who are happily married to none believers. I have to say being religious whatever the religion may not make you a good person. My OH is more spiritaul than me - I was turned off religion by my mum who was over the top and narrow minded. Live and let live and I hope the mum doesnt interfere too much - she cant live his life for him. If anything kills this relationship it will be her.

[majorbloodnock]

....I do hope that the thread can centre on the relationship rather than religion as such. I don't see the potential problems as anything different from multi-cultural or any other sort of "different" relationship....

 

And the relationship itself. This is, in my opinion, the crucial point. Your daughter's boyfriend's previous relationship didn't fail because of the previous girlfriend's religion; it failed because of her (and quite possibly his) actions.

 

We all are who we are because of our choices and actions, and whilst any religion may provide us with a framework, it doesn't make the choices for us. No matter how altruistic our beliefs, they don't make us good people unless we choose to act on those beliefs. And conversely it doesn't matter how dark are our thoughts; if we choose to ignore or resist them, our consciences can remain clear.

 

This boyfriend hasn't fallen for a facet of atheism or agnosticism; he's fallen for your daughter as a person. She's a complete package of good points and bad, the sum of which he finds attractive. Assuming he's over 18, what business is it of anyone else's - including his mother - whether or not he's right in doing so?

[Cinnamon]

Wise words,Major

[Chucky Mama]

Sounds to me like there are two issues - the church and the mother, and both need to be dealt with separately.

 

I agree, the mother sounds like a bigger issue to me as she is putting the BF in a difficult position from the start. I am in a mixed race marriage (no cultural or religious issues attached). My Grandmother In Law was quite negative and racist behind my back for some years. It was however not really a race issue, she just wasn't a very nice person at that time. She is now lovely to me and totally adoring of me and the children. It was a matter of giving her the time and space to figure it out herself. If there is a future together I think that they need to talk through both his mothers input in his life and also his religion but they are 2 seperate things in my eyes. They would also need to discuss at some point how they would want to raise children. This would perhaps indicate how compatable they really are.

[Chickendoodle]

Thank you all for your thoughts and views. I will just have to keep my fingers crossed. YD has had her heart broken so many times that I worry about her in a new relationship

[A chickychickychick-ENN!!]

Aw, Doodle - I get the impression a bit o' worry is always part of being a mum. Hugs!

[Cinnamon]

.....................Am still waiting for Christians input on this

[Egluntyne]

When I saw the thread title I wondered for a moment......

[Chucky1]

And the relationship itself. This is, in my opinion, the crucial point. Your daughter's boyfriend's previous relationship didn't fail because of the previous girlfriend's religion; it failed because of her (and quite possibly his) actions.

 

Well said though I think it always takes two to tango. No argument is ever totally one sided

 

I hope that mine and my wife's experience is of some help to you. My DW of 24 years is RC. We live in the west of Ireland and although nothing has ever been said, I think they still burn witches and heratics here. I am atheist but I trot along to church every now and again.

 

Don't get me wrong we have our moments. We argue about the chickens or the garden or anything else, but never religion

[Chickendoodle]

Thanks Chucky - that's very reassuring.

 

It seems now that the whole family is invoved - BF's big sister screamed at him on the phone yesterday that he had broken his promise to himself and them all. She is very happily married to a non believer by the way!

 

My YD did point out to her BF that she thought they were all behaving in a very non-christian (big C and small c !) way in making her feel so unwelcome. He completely agreed with her and is going to talk to them and point out that they are being pretty unfair and judgemental. His sister hasn't even met my YD !

 

I am sure that time will smooth it all over and I once they know her they will be fine but it has made her feel very awkward through no fault of her own. I feel very upset and cross on her behalf but reassured by the postings on here. Thanks as always everyone

[The Dogmother]

How awful for them, as a couple embarking on a new relationship - it would be nice if his family could be more inclusive and tolerant.

[Seagazer]

I'm wondering if the last relationship had a very big effect on the family as it seems very unfair that they're not giving your DD a chance. To be like this and not have met her yet seems to me that they've all been really upset by the last relationship. Perhaps they are overly worried about if it happens again?

 

We're not particularly religious in our and our extended family so have no other advice really. I hope they can work it out.

[docsquid]

How awful for them, as a couple embarking on a new relationship - it would be nice if his family could be more inclusive and tolerant.

 

Sadly, inclusion and tolerance don't often sit happily with religion All I can say is I hope that they learn to see your daughter for what she is, not for what she does/doesn't believe. I think you can be quite different and still be happy together.

[Becka]

Aren't we lucky to have variety in life? My brother, sister and I were all brought up in a tolerant agnostic household. All of us have married lapsed Catholics. None of us have converted to a faith and we have all had problems when arranging our Weddings. My husband and I were married by a Church of Scotland minister because the Catholic Church didn't fancy my credentials! I would've preferred a civil ceremony buy my MIL insisted we had a religious ceremony although it wasn't provided by the religion that she followed. I have never understood the logic behind that one but maybe that's because I don't have a religion. My husband is a lapsed Catholic and none of the children have been baptised which is of great consternation to the MIL and I have had to stop her and her White Priest friend performing a private ceremony for them in her house. One of the reasons I stopped the makeshift baptism was because she told my husband that she didn't care that I wasn't going to heaven but she wanted her grandchildren there with her. I have put up with many hurtful comments and complied with requests that went against my agnostic tendencies but that one comment just went too far. I find it very difficult to understand someone who takes great pride in their faith behaving in such a self-fulfilling and arrogant manner which shows a clear lack of tolerance. My husband and I have never had any difficulty dealing with religious topics or differences as we both respect each others view point but sadly it's my MIL who causes any tensions in this department. Maybe it's a generational issue? There are so many wonderful values and lessons taught through various religions but sadly some very religious people manage only to see one way and it's very often to the exclusion of others. Religion needn't be an issue unless you allow it to be.

Best of luck!

Becka

[Ain't Nobody Here]

Your DD and her BF sound like they are being very mature and open-minded in their outlook (unlike some of his family ).

 

I am a total, dyed in the wool atheist but my half-sister is being ordained in June this year! We couldn't have more different beliefs but we just don't talk about it, while respecting each other's point of view.

 

I never thought in a million years I'd ever be attending an ordination .

[whoopsie]

Well I was raised by a Catholic mother and and Atheist father - it was a very balanced upbringing and they have a very happy 36 year (so far) marriage! I think it all depends on whether the relationship/partnership is stronger or the religion

[Chickendoodle]

6 months down the line my y/d was proposed to yesterday and the wedding has been set for May 14th next year

 

They are very happy together. The Church seems like a very nice community and my YD has embraced it and seems so much more settled in herself. She attends the services and helps out at youth groups etc and is very comfortable with it all.

 

Having a proper Church wedding is quite involved (I mean "proper" as opposed to just using the Church as a venue) - they have to attend 6 sessions of pre-marriage counselling for instance which would probably be a good thing for everyone!

 

So we are now in the midst of arrangements - very exciting times!

 

Must go and buy a hat

Edited August 4, 2010 by Guest