The Dogmother Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 All of the above, especially text speak and the use of 'could/would of' when it should be could/would HAVE' My Grandma was Italian born and bred, coming to the UK in her early twenties; she insisted on speaking almost perfect English with hardly a trace of an accent and would often correct English folk on their spelling and pronunciation. I used to find it embarrassing as a child but now I totally understand her 'fetish'. Sign outside the Co-op yesterday about their Fairtrade products, including 'Banana's'.... Gah! I wish now that I'd taken a photo of the poster. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majorbloodnock Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I agree with all that plain bad spelling and grammar can be very frustrating; after all, language is for communicating and if mistakes get in the way of understanding, the language can't do its job properly. HOWEVER..... Would all those here whose grammar and spelling are consistently perfect please make yourselves known? After all, it's difficult complaining about mistakes without setting oneself up for a fall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majorbloodnock Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I agree we are all becoming very lazy especially with texting... And that irritates the life out of me. Text is a noun, it is not a verb. Me: What are you doing, son? Son: I'm texting Dad. Me: No, you are sending Dad a text! Son: No, I haven't sent it yet, I'm still texting. Me: Son: Have you got the cash out for my bus ticket tomorrow? Me: Sorry, I didn't realise you needed it for tomorrow. Son: But I texted you!!! Me: No, you couldn't have. Son: I DID!! Me: No, you did not You may have sent me a text, but you most certainly haven't "texted" me! Oh dear; I think I'm about to make myself unpopular. I posted earlier that English is a living language, and I'm going to stand by that. The important point is that it evolves to meet the communication needs of those who use it, no matter how much the more traditionally minded of us think of it as mangling. The first few people who started referring to the act of sending a text message as "texting" were indeed incorrect since at that point there was no such verb as "to text". However, what makes a word acceptable is usage, not rules, and since most English speaking mobile phone users understand what is meant by the term "texting", it's not getting in the way of communication (many younger speakers might say communication has been enhanced) and so the term has become acceptable and accepted. Since it is now in the dictionary, we have to bow to the fact that it is now a legitimate verb. We none of us, of course, have to use it, however. And before I'm lambasted for pandering to sloppy English, I'd like a show of hands as to who still talks about a refrigerator instead of a 'fridge, who insists on using the term "mobile telephone" instead of "mobile phone" or even "mobile", and who still insists on the apostrophes for 'cello and 'flu' (they are, after all, violoncello and influenza, after all)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alis girls Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 oops smacked wrist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chortle Chook Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 This thread is an education in iteself. Feel I'm slipping about in my own sloppy writing -skid, fall. But then I remind myself that Shakespear couldn't even spell his name However I do think that new words can only be counted as language evolving if they add to meaning, not if they detract. By this token 'texting' would seem fine to me, but muddling fewer and less or 'bit of' with 'drop of' (my Gran's bug bear as in ' would you like a drop of milk', not 'a bit of milk') is not good. I still do it, mind and hear my Gran correcting me from yonder. Another one my Gran was always correcting was the use of 'itch' as an active verb rather than a passive verb and noun i.e. 'you don't itch a spot, you scratch an itch or scratch a spot if it itches' Now have I got that right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ain't Nobody Here Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Hadn't thought of that one before but I reckon you're spot on (not an itchy spot, obviously ). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Looney Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I agree that language must evolve and although things do infuriate me I am guilty of frequently using incorrect words and making up new verbs! I was a language student so am guilty of being incorrect in three different languages One thing that did drive me so mad I had to turn the radio off was a young fella who kept saying 'much' instead of many! I have had help from so much people....so much people have told me they like my music... Aargh! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 the itch one gets me too CC - I had to correct Rosie the other day after she'd learned it from somewhere. None of us pretends to be perfect, least of all me, but we all have bugbears which annoy us and in some cases hamper understanding. 'aitch' not 'haitch' 'Ask' not 'aks' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mum Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 ... Oh dear; I think I'm about to make myself unpopular ... Not in the slightest As the Americans say: "It's become so popular, it's now a verb!" (and not just about my example with text ) There is a time-lapse between being used incorrectly and then ending up in a dictionary However, one of the issues businesses have with employing some youngsters is their inability to spell. More and more often spelling mistakes are attributed to companies losing business: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-14130854 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lydia Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 I think it's becoming more of an issue because everyone communicates electronically so much more - be that by text, social media, online etc. I was taught to type so it's easy for me to type the proper words but hardly anyone learns to type these days and there are fewer secretaries around who type up correspondence and check grammar and spelling as they go. I also think it's important to know when to use 'text speak' and when not to. Use 'text speak' on Facebook and other social media if you must (I will only cringe inwardly) but don't do it in a corporate environment and expect to be taken seriously. It really annoys me at work when I receive an email along the lines of "pls send me ur mag my add is 22 any road, london se5 4tt,thx". Emails like that tend to find themselves at the bottom of the pile. There are probably some workplaces where that's acceptable but in most it isn't. And don't get me started on apostrophe misuse because I could be here a while. I was given an HTC for Christmas and was dismayed to find the apostophe key is on the second screen thereby encouraging people not to use one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surfer_chicken Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 If you're annoyed by grammar and spelling you might like this blog post about the mysterious 'alot': http://hyperboleandahalf.blogspot.com/2010/04/alot-is-better-than-you-at-everything.html My friends get quite obsessive over checking spelling in facebook posts, now I get someone to check everything before I hit the send button just incase Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woodcat Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I can never pick apart somones spelling simply because i understand what it's like to not be able to. I'm a dyslexic and it doesn't matter how many times i check something a mistake will always slip through. What really gets my goat is when somone decides to correct me. If your message come across despite the fact that a word is mispelt or an apostrophy is in the wrong place then what does it matter. I understand with things like websites that take a long time and you build them but in emails and things that are done quickly i don't have time to be proof reading them for hours before i send them. I don't post on internet forums like this one very much because i don't have the time to spend 30 mins proofreading every post and the number of times people correct my spelling as a way of attempting to undermine my point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Woodcat, I don't think anyone on here would even think of correcting any posts, so please don't worry If we can understand them, then that's the main thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olly Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Can I endorse that - we Mods are far too busy to go around correcting spelling on here. We might sometimes amend a title where it's obvious that someone has written it in a hurry and it doesn't make sense, but that's all. This is a fascinating debate, and I concur with Major Bloodnock above - English is a living language and it's wonderful to see how it develops. I am also virulently anti 'textspeak' however. The thing that drives me to distraction is the unnecessary development of words where there's already a perfectly good one available. One of my colleagues referred recently to a report being 'authored by X', and I'm ashamed to say that my voice rose as I replied 'you mean WRITTEN BY, don't you!'. Another one is 'gifted' as in 'this was gifted to the charity by ...' - when they mean given. Isn't it amazing how these little things can wind us up so much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majorbloodnock Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Following on from Woodcat's point, I firmly believe that correcting someone before criticism has been invited is bad manners. Correcting someone in public is just plain rude. I also find it rather distasteful when, in a discussion, someone's valid point is ignored (or, worse, ridiculed) simply on the strength of grammatical or spelling mistakes; the assumption is that if someone isn't eloquent then they're not intelligent, and that's a very arrogant stance to take. However, turning a tactful blind eye to language mistakes means accepting the extra effort that goes with trying to understand bad English. I, for one, am perfectly happy to do that so long as I can trust the other person is at least trying their best. As soon as I see mistakes that are the result of someone not being bothered, I become a lot less forgiving, and since I know my English is good, I can become VERY critical indeed if I wish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickendoodle Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I get so cross with shop signs where they announce such gems as "reduced by 50% off" Please either say "reduced by 50% "or "50% off" It also really bugs me on the news when they say "inflation has come down " Inflation has not gone down - the RATE of inflation has gone down. Inflation is something going up! And don't get me started on apostrophes. It is no wonder that our spelling is getting really confused as all the Microsoft headings are the American spelling - "favorites" etc. I like the English extra U although I accept that it means exactly the same thing. The word will probably have evolved within a generation without the U as will all our extra U's - colour, flavour etc etc. Sad I think Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leeloo Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Some of the previously mentioned things drive me crazy, too! I generally have good spelling and grammar, but I mess up occasionally and cringe when I realize it. A friend of mine is an avid reader and is also a grammar fanatic. She often calls me on it when I slip up which I find rude and irritating. I think it's because I have more education than she does so it makes her feel superior when she catches me in a mistake. I try not to obsess about Internet postings and emails as though they were peer-reviewed journal articles, however! There's a fine line between being attentive to proper grammar for clarity and being pretentious, IMO! I sometimes use common expressions like "hot water heater" and she likes to point out that it is a redundant expression. Yeah, well, it's what I grew up calling it and it's what 90% of the people I talk to call it so I'm not going to change it on her behalf! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Looney Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I only realised recently (following something I wrote on Facebook ) that I spell yoghurt differently to most people! I have always put h before the u but it seems the popular spelling doesn't have one. Someone picked me up on it, privately at least, not on my Facebook wall so I looked it up. Turns out I'm not wrong....just in a minority! For years I spelt definitely as definAtely before I realised my mistake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I always spell it with an 'H' too, Loon, so you're not the only one. My current big bear is the word 'shop', as often mis-used on websites i.e. 'shop electronics' *fumes quietly*. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chickendoodle Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I think yoghurt is correct - it is spelt like that on the ones I buy anyway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dogmother Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 According to the free online dictionary that I use, both spellings are acceptable, although the version without the 'h' seems to be American. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
majorbloodnock Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I think yoghurt is correct - it is spelt like that on the ones I buy anyway Officially, that particular food can be spelt in three different ways; yogurt, yoghurt and yoghourt. Although if you add any kind of chemical faux-fruit flavouring then it's just plain wrong however you spell it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Looney Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Oh good, not just me then! I have two different brands in the fridge both no h! Oh 'eck, I can see this becoming an obsession...yog(h)(o)urt spotting! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cinnamon Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 ...........it will probably make this evenings shift at work a bit more interesting for me too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lavenders_Blue Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 I spell yoghurt with an aitch (not a haitch ) too. I also get a little irritated by the use of nouns as verbs (e.g. medalling = to win a medal, plus other examples already mentioned on here) BUT at the same time I do understand that this one of the unique ways in which our language changes and evolves. 'Texting' doesn't grate nearly so much as it used to used to, as I have heard it so much! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
