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sarkymite

anxious newbie having chicken trouble

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Hi, I've just joined the forum, and we have just got our very first chickens (brought them home on Saturday). Bear with me, this may be a bit long and rambly - we haven't exactly had a smooth run of it this week...

 

We have an Eglu Classic with extended run which we got 2nd hand having read up that it could house up to 4 medium chickens or 2-ish large ones.

 

We got 3 hens on Saturday. All are POL and all have been reared together from tiny chicks, and have been kept free ranging in a large field and sleeping in a luxuriously large barn with lots of other hens, until we got them.

 

We have 1 white leghorn, one Oxford blue and one Oxford brown - the blue and the brown are both based on rhode island red, the blue is crossed with coucou maran, not sure what the brown is crossed with. We each (me, my OH and his daughter) chose one.

 

The white leghorn must've already been laying - she laid a small white egg Sunday morning, a large White egg Monday morning, small ones on Tues and Weds mornings.

The other two hadn't started laying, but on Weds AM we had one small brown egg, we think possibly the Oxford blue as she looks more mature than the brown going on comb/wattle appearance.

 

Over the few days we've had them we'd noted the white leghorn to be quite dominant, the brown to be very human-friendly (really sweet and lovely and friendly) and the blue to be scared of everything and very flighty.

 

During the day on Wednesday though we had a serious pecking problem while we were out at work - got back to find the brown one missing half her tail feathers and all the feathers down one side of her rear, bleeding profusely and very subdued. Luckily I got back in daylight (unusual) or I wouldn't have seen it til morning. I separated her from the other two, cleaned the wounds and in the absence of having any chicken-specific antiseptic took the advice of a chicken owning friend and put savlon on her. She spent the night in our old wooden rabbit hutch and was quite perky this morning. I spent half an hour at 7am today dividing the run into two using garden canes so that she could be outside and close to her companions over the day without being pecked - this worked well.

 

However, this morning we had two weird eggs in the eglu - one soft one (membrane but no shell) and one very tiny slightly deformed white one, neither of them in the nest box - both fallen through under the roosting bars. DUring the day things have deteriorated - I worked from home this afternoon and found the white leghorn is now attacking the blue - same location, starting at the base of the back near the tail feathers and she really isn't leaving her alone - it's incessant pecking. I've managed to catch the flighty blue one and apply anti-pecking spray but it didn't make a difference - white one just wipes beak on ground in between pecks and carries right on pecking. Blue one not injured or bleeding yet but her feathers are starting to look ragged. So.... this evening we've put brown one back in the rabbit hutch to keep her safe while she heals, and the other two are back in the eglu. Someone recommended vicks vaporub to deter pecking?? I've ordered purple spray and stockholm tar but they won't arrive for a few days (or I can get some on Saturday).

 

So, what is going on with our hens? The leghorn is the smallest. The brown is medium sized and the blue is bigger than we thought she would be - I'd call her large. So we have a large hen, a medium and a "small-medium" - is the Eglu too small for them? Are they stressed because they are used to having acres of space to roam until they came to us? Is it likely to settle down? Is the leghorn actually aggressive and likely to continue to be a problem, and can she be trained out of it? Are the 2 weird eggs this morning anything to do with it? What are we doing wrong? How long do we keep the brown one separated and how do we avoid problems when we put her back in?

 

I must say that I'm already regretting getting the eglu classic rather than the cube just cause the classic looks a bit small and you have to get down to ground level to do anything with it (and I was commando crawling in the run at 7am today to sort out feeders/water further in so that it could be divided down the middle - which wasn't nice!) - but there weren't any 2nd hand cubes available and the classic seemed to be suitable for 3 hens. I feel like we're failing in our quest to own chickens before we've even started!

 

Sorry for the really long post - I'm getting quite attached to the hens already and really worried we aren't doing the right things despite all our extensive pre-chicken-purchasing research.

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Sounds like the leghorn is your problem. She needs to be separated from the others or taken back to where you got her from. That's nasty behaviour. They may well have all been raised together, but that doesn't make them automatic best buddies. If they were in a big flock they may well have never come face to face, plus any lower ranking girls would have had lots of room and perches to escape unwanted attention.

 

So sorry this has happened. It's usually a lovely experience getting your first hens. Good luck for the future :)

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Welcome to the forum :) .

 

I agree it's probably best to see if the farm/breeder will take the leghorn back. I've never had bullying like that and I've bought about 5 lots of 2 or 3 hens over the years that were brought up together. You could persevere but I reckon it could be pretty stressful and long drawn out and will totally spoil the fun of having new chickens.

 

I wouldn't worry about the weird eggs, it's common to have strange ones now and then, especially when they first start to lay.

 

Keep us posted - I hope you get things sorted :) .

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Again I agree, I would try to return this Attila the hen, if that isn't an option I would keep her seperate and keep the good girls together, that will knock her confidence and i would try to reintroduce her in a few weeks, alternatively you could fit her with a bumpa bit. I don't think its the housing that's the problem but I know what you mean about the run, but it's the hen that's the issue. I think they will also need distractions, maybe broccoli hanging, or sweet corn, that may give them something else to think about.

You have been very unlucky, chin up and it really can only get better

Don't doubt yourself you have just had a really bad start.we have all had them and it's a case of onwards and upwards

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I too have had to return an Exchequer Leghorn, not because of aggressiveness but because she wailed and screeched almost constantly at everything! :roll: Whilst she may have eventually settled down, I couldn't take the risk and the supplier agreed to take her back. They did say the breed can be quite flighty, active and are better suited to larger spaces.

I agree that it sounds like peace and happiness for all concerned will be restored when she's returned.

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Thanks for your replies. From what you've all said I'm guessing I am right in thinking that this isn't normal "establishing the pecking order" behaviour.

 

I might try separating the leghorn for a while and reintroducing her - but how long should I separate her for? I can't really do this until the brown one is healed up a bit anyway as I can't put her back in with either of them until she's less raw and we simply don't have space to keep all 3 of them separate (we can't free range during the week while we're out because of risk of predators - the run will only split in 2 and we only have the 1 spare rabbit hutch).

 

Step-daughter will be gutted as the leghorn was her choice and is "her pet" and she was dead keen on having specifically a leghorn (she wanted ONLY Leghorn or Amber so we had to find a place that stocked those specific breeds and then they didn't have any Ambers) - if we do have to contact the place we got them from (a reputable poultry farm) I doubt they'll have another leghorn available (they only had a couple left last week) and I don't think she'll want to choose another type so we may end up with just two hens and then maybe have to introduce a 3rd in spring but that will be difficult too won't it?

 

Also will the farm be willing to take her back? I sort of thought that you sort of take pot luck when buying poultry - or would they be willing to help if she really is just a nasty bird? Should I expect my money back, or an exchange or should I only expect them to take the hen off my hands?

 

By the way I think she's eaten all the feathers she's plucked - despite how many the brown hen is missing, I can't find a single one. Ugh this is all causing me so much anxiety - I feel bad for step-daughter, bad for all of the hens that they must be miserable, and really bad for my OH because he really didn't want chickens, he took a LOT of persuading and the brown one was his choice and she's such a sweetie, and in less than a week she's almost been murdered by her companion, looks gory and mangled and is in isolation in the rabbit hutch :(:(

 

What would happen if we free-range them all together on Saturday under close supervision? Or is that just a terribly bad idea?

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Welcome to the wonderful (and stressful) world of chickenkeeping!

 

I think freeranging isn't a bad idea at all. It would give the Oxfords a chance to get away from your nasty Leghorn. Personally I wouldn't keep her. Feather eating is apparently a very hard habit to break and she might go back to plucking and feather eating anytime they are bored.

Hanging up treats might distract them a bit.

 

It might be sad for your step daughter, but it isn't fair on the chickens either and you can't explain anything to them. Your step daughter might at least come to understand. I think she would rather have a sweet hen, that is in for a cuddle, then one that hurts her "friends".

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It might be sad for your step daughter, but it isn't fair on the chickens either and you can't explain anything to them. Your step daughter might at least come to understand. I think she would rather have a sweet hen, that is in for a cuddle, then one that hurts her "friends".

 

Yes - I understand this (and I'm already starting to dislike her for the stress she's causing the other two!) and I am sure she will too if it comes to that - just a real shame for her as she's been so excited about it and put so much thought into choosing "her" hen, and she doesn't have the benfit of age with which to look philosophically at things. But she had to admit that the brown hen's injury is nasty - so we shall see how the weekend goes, talk with her, and take it from there.

 

We'll try free ranging with two/three of us supervising to break up fights this weekend - have heard a water spray can be a good training tool for aggressive birds - is there any truth in that?

 

If we do get rid of her, would it be feasible to introduce a different bird at this stage or do you think we should wait a while?

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Getting a new third hen would be easiest if you do it as soon as possible, I think. When everything is still as new as possible to all hens.

 

I think a water bottle will do fine, but they are less likely to break out in fights when they have more room and distraction. Free ranging might be calming stuff down.

You might want to stick the Leghorn in the rabbit hutch and keep the two Oxford together. Seeing as it is her that is causing the trouble and not the brown.

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If things don't work out, one idea may be to swap her for another leghorn? It might just be her? If you got another almost identical one then maybe she'd be ok? Just a thought if the free ranging does not solve the issues. I have three white leghorns, used to have four and they are very flighty chooks, not known as the friendliest. Mine free range all day as no predators (due to location) so can't give proper advice with chooks in a run.

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I'm really sorry to hear you're having such a rough time. I had a similar but much less severe issue when I first had mine and I felt so guilty that it was my fault they were having a bad time. So you're not totally alone in this.

 

I agree with with a combination of comments from other posters. I would put the leghorn in the rabbit hutch end on her own, and put the other two in the Eglu end together. If you cover up the blood on the brown one with purple spray or something she should be OK with the blue. Then the Oxfords will have the Eglu as home. Maybe have a go at FRing them all together and see what happens.

 

However - if I were you my first port of call would be to try to return the legbar. I can understand that could cause a bit of upset but you obviously care about your animals and in this case their welfare has to be your first concern.

 

It will be worth the effort in the end!

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[quote="Cat tails"

You might want to stick the Leghorn in the rabbit hutch and keep the two Oxford together. Seeing as it is her that is causing the trouble and not the brown.

 

But I shouldn't put the brown one back in with anyone else til she's a bit healed, right? I've read they'll peck at bloody wounds out of fascination/attraction to red/liking the taste of the blood - so pesumably for the time being the brown one has to be on her own until she's back to being brown again? Hoping we'll have purple spray tomorrow - if I liberally douse her in that it would be safe to reintroduce her to the blue??

 

I'd love to put the leghorn in the hutch for my own peace of mind while I'm not there to supervise - but it can only be one or the other.

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I'm really sorry to hear you're having such a rough time. I had a similar but much less severe issue when I first had mine and I felt so guilty that it was my fault they were having a bad time. So you're not totally alone in this.

 

I agree with with a combination of comments from other posters. I would put the leghorn in the rabbit hutch end on her own, and put the other two in the Eglu end together. If you cover up the blood on the brown one with purple spray or something she should be OK with the blue. Then the Oxfords will have the Eglu as home. Maybe have a go at FRing them all together and see what happens.

 

However - if I were you my first port of call would be to try to return the legbar. I can understand that could cause a bit of upset but you obviously care about your animals and in this case their welfare has to be your first concern.

 

It will be worth the effort in the end!

 

Aah thanks - its good to know I'm not alone! I think we will try separation for the leghorn and put the Oxfords together (plus lots of purple spray!!!), as a first resort - then if she doesn't calm down we'll have to take her back. But I know step-daughter will want us to at least try before we give up on her.

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I'm a great believer in big runs or free range they need plenty of room to get away while they are sorting out the pecking order I think separating the Leghorn you will have to go through it all again when you put her back in. I have leghorns they are very gobby and flighty can't get near mine they are my wild birds they literally run out the pop hole in the morning run loose lay big eggs take themselves to bed I don't have much to do with them only every 6 months for a check over and touchwood for wild birds they are in great condition lol not meaning anything nasty to you by this comment but if they have been freeranging a field and are now penned its a bit like us living in a mansion then going to a flat it will be a bit of a shock to them and I think maybe the Leghorn is not suited to a pen do what others have said stick a beak bit on her spray the other girls wounds and try and let them free range as much as possibly be warned you may want to clip the Leghorns wing first and don't bother with the Stockholm tar it's so messy it just gets stuck everywhere.If things don't get better then maybe return her and stick with the other 3 for now leanne :)

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Amber chickens are so much friendlier your step daughter will be a lot happier as she will be able to pick her up.the leghorn will never get tame. I've got a columbine which is a cross with a leghorn and the breeder were I get my hens from say they are very flighty.she is nearly 3 now and I can't get near her. I've had and got ambers speckley which are lovely. Bluebell is very nervous xx

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Sorry you have been having such a difficult time with your girls.

I had a hard time introducing pekins to my wyandottes so I know how you feel.

Sadly I think some chickens are a lot nastier than others.

I don't have a lot of advice because I ended up separating mine but I hope you get things sorted really soon.

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Thank you so much to everyone who has posted replies and given advice. I am really grateful.

 

Today's update is that this morning leghorn (Willow) and blue (Petula) seemed fine so I left them together. Brown (Henrietta) gave us an egg in the rabbit hutch last night!! :D

I put H into the partitioned off bit of run again this morning and left W and P together in the other half - went off to work.

 

When I came back briefly at lunchtime W had removed a circle of feathers from P's back near the base of the tail and all 3 birds seemed agitated. So I thought I'd put W in the rabbit hutch (which has a ramp to some downstairs space on grass so not as cramped as you might think and would have "done" for the rest of the day) but when I tried to catch her she lunged at me - she got me under my fingernail which hurts like heck and bled a lot (pathetic me!) and also on the back of my hand where she has broken the skin and given me a bruise. I realised that if I got hold of her and then lost my grip on the journey up the garden I may never catch her again - so decided moving her was a 2-person job. Her wing is clipped but boy she can move - I suspect even with clipped wing she could probably scale 5 foot fence...

 

So, reluctantly I left her in with P and put a load of Vicks Vaporub on P's back - which didn't have the desired effect as W seems to actually like the stuff! Also sprayed the anti-peck spray on P for good measure (got it on my fingers by accident and had a nasty surprise when eating my sandwiches later!!).

 

My OH gets home early on Fridays so at 3 o clock he came back, noticed the circle of naked skin on P is now red so he let H out to free range, put P in H's section and left W in the other half of the run - she promptly found a way through the barrier she was so keen to get to P - so after a bit of barrier-fortifying he then left them in that configuration until dusk. W put herself to bed quite early and was sleepy so reluctantly (and as P was getting quite distressed at not being able to get into the Eglu) we've put P back in with W for the night, liberally sprayed in antispetic - they will be separated again first thing in the morning. H followed us round the garden until well after bedtime and then came running when called (what a CUTIE!!!) and sat to be picked up and have cream put on her wounds (which look like they are healing nicely) and then back into the hutch for the night.

 

We are going to talk to OH's daughter this evening/tomorrow AM and strongly persuade her to take W back. I phoned the poultry farm this afternoon for advice and she said she would swop W for a different hen and agreed that it didn't sound "normal" - so we are hoping to persuade SD that it would be best for all concerned (including W who clearly isn't happy if she's behaving like that) if we swop for a more docile hen. I understand that the choices available are likely to be:

Oxford brown

Oxford blue (can't have another of these, they are too big - eglu will be too crowded!)

Nera

White Sussex

Speckeldy

 

Sadly the Ambers are out of stock and we aren't going for another leghorn!

Of the available hens I know the browns are very docile (and we could leg-ring the new bird so that we can tell them apart) but I don't know much about the other ones, including what sort of size they get to (and mindful that they have to be in the run during the day while we are at work because of foxes so ideally a docile, medium sized breed). I suspect SD would choose a White Sussex as she is so keen on white/pale feathers. What would people recommend?

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I would think a Sussex would be ok. They can be big birds but are usually (in my experience anyway) solid and dependable things. Of the 4 I've had/got one was the boss, probably two were the second in command, and one is a wimp! I wouldn't describe them as flighty at all and aside from our wimp all have been comfortable with cuddles eventually.

 

It really does sound like sending the legbar back would be a good idea as she does seem to have it in for both the others :roll:

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We have just had "the conversation" with SD - she is quietly disappointed but said that she understood the issues and that there wasn't much point in sleeping on it and that she agreed to taking Willow back. She said she had been looking forward to cuddling Willow this weekend and getting to know her and I think the dawning realisation that Willow is not a cuddly hen has probably helped soften the blow. She went so far as to say she didn't mind but she's very quiet and has taken herself to her room for a bit - she is being very mature but I think she is quite upset. It must be quite a crushing issue for a kid, I remember how quickly I got attached to pets when I was a youngster and you don't want to think that your pet is capable of that sort of behaviour - youngsters do attribute human qualities and human feelings to their pets :(

 

We have looked at the available other breeds with her and are veering towards a Nera, which is black with golden flecking in the front bib - I have read a few "reviews" online that suggest that they are very docile and placid (in fact one poultry seller advertises them as "ideal for the eglu") and the Nera perhaps lay more eggs and are slightly less prone to broodiness than the Sussexes. However the choice will be hers and she will decide tomorrow when we get to the poultry farm.

 

I feel awful for SD and bad for all 3 hens that they've had such a traumatic week (and I need a very large glass of wine myself right now!) but I also feel very relieved. I was not looking forward to having to try out isolation/reintegration techniques that might well not work and having a chicken that remained wild and unfriendly for the rest of its days. I am just glad that Henrietta appears to be recovering from her ordeal (and so grateful that we have at least one very friendly hen! Maybe with two friendly hens we will persuade Petula not to be so scared of everything...)

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Hi there, I am sorry you are having a difficult introduction to hen keeping :( However I am sorry to say that imo leghorns are not suitable for being confined to a run. I had a brown leghorn which I raised from a chick and even the whole garden wasn't big enough :!: They are earth movers! and I dont think are for the domestic garden/setup . Mine went to a wildlife centre ( by prior arrangement) where she has acres to live in with loads of other poultry and is very happy. So despite your reservations I would return your leghorn and think about a breed which will be more suited to confinement. Please also try to give your other two some free range time if you can as they look like fairly biggish hens as well.

 

Every best wish. Ax

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Please also try to give your other two some free range time if you can as they look like fairly biggish hens as well.

 

Every best wish. Ax

 

Yes, dont worry - the hens will free range every Friday afternoon and on Saturday and Sunday through the winter, and almost every evening through the summer - we just can't have them out when there's "Ooops, word censored!"ody home (though who knows as we get more used to hen-keeping and less anxious!!).

 

We had been advised to keep them shut in the run for the first week - but OH had Henrietta out free roaming this afternoon/evening as she is so tame and she loved it (and has done a great job tidying up a veg bed that needs digging over!). Petula will get a turn at it tomorrow along with Henrietta (just as soon as we've got the purple spray to put on both their wounds so they don't go for each other), and when the new chicken is settled in she will join them.

 

I am glad I didn't let the leghorn out though - might never have got her back in! She will have plenty of roaming when she is back at the poultry farm and hopefully she will do better in a bigger, wilder flock.

 

My next mission is to learn what all the different chicken noises mean....

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